The Catholic Spiritual Life: A Practical Guide w/ Joe Schmid

¶1Joe Schmid at long last. Welcome to the Philosophy for the People podcast. Thanks for having me on, Pat. I'm very excited. Yeah.

¶2So, I mean, boy oh boy, there's there's so much that we could talk about and there's probably so much that people would expect us to talk about. Uh, but we're in the business of defying um expectations and we're not going to talk about all the stuff that people probably think we're going to talk about uh for a couple of reasons. One, you've already talked about all that stuff massively on your channel and elsewhere. And there's no reason to go over it again. All the all the philosophy, all the arguments for God and Catholicism.

¶3Rather, we want to do something different and focus on the spiritual life and spiritual practices. I think this will be great for this channel. Um because one, it's it's not unheard of. I've done stuff like this before on the channel. Uh but you're somebody who has recently, you know, um uh converted, reverted.

¶4It's like there needs to be a term between convert and revert to kind of explain people like you and and similarly me too, right? Whatever that is, like which one is it, right? Um, and uh, and how important it is to to keep this in view, especially for for for people like us, Joe, and people watching. It's so easy to get wrapped up, not just in online apologetics and debates, but to get wrapped up in the life of the mind itself. I mean, I I don't know about you, Joe, but I have certainly made the intellectual stuff an idol >> at points in my life and neglected neglected.

¶5And I p God straightened me out right painfully at times but neglected really um seriously the spiritual life because of that. So give us a little background for yourself here you know is that is that some it sounds like that there's some resonance there with you as well. Um >> yeah I think so. I definitely think so. I mean I've always sort of >> I mean I was very devout and I still like I was very devout when I was younger.

¶6So for people for the audience who doesn't know I mean surely everyone knows at this point but I grew up Catholic, right? And then in high school I decon converted, became an atheist um and then an agnostic and then now am Catholic. Um and I I was very devout um when I was younger, but even still I think um at the very least one of my primary modes of engagement with the faith was intellectual and then that probably was turned into an idol. Yeah. Yeah, I mean certainly in high school um uh you know and it's caught up with all different sorts of vices and whatnot, you know, pride and um yeah, just seeking a claim and approval and and those sorts of things.

¶7>> And then since my um since my reversion, I' I've just >> I've become really passionate about, you know, the spiritual life. Um and just like how to improve uh with respect to, you know, growing closer to God and growing in my relationship with Christ and whatnot. That's not to say that um I'm there yet. I'm very far. But um this is actually kind of one of my passions now.

¶8And I I just I love um spiritual reading now. Um you know, on Sundays and whatnot. >> And uh and yeah, I want to make it not just about the mind. Um and that's a constant temptation for people who are philosophically inclined. So I think this is going to be a helpful remedy.

¶9Um and I it's something that I'm not going to at least have focused on so far at all on my channel or anything else. So I'm glad we're going to be able to do this. Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. I mean, just just spend another minute on this.

¶10I mean, you are ex I mean, you are extremely accomplished, right? And and extremely, you know, impressive in in in in what you've done. Um, and boy, I mean, I I really resonate with what what you're saying, right? The need for and for me even outside of philosophy for for other areas of my life, like the need for the material success, for the approval to be able to parade it in front of other people, the things that that you've done. Um, yeah.

¶11All right, we're gonna talk all that stuff, right? It's so bad. And I still I still struggle with it. Like every time I have any little accomplishment, like I want to share it, right? I want to like do I have to, right?

¶12Or can I just keep the or like can I just like do a little penance and just like >> not like make a post about can I just keep this one to myself, right? Is like and that is so hard for me, right? If I'm just being honest, right? >> Yeah. No.

¶13And I've sort of undergone like a value shift, you know, like um I mean I still am attached to these previous values that I should become detached from. But you know, like in the past I was way more obsessive about, you know, like oh yeah, all these fancy pants publications and fancy fancy pants institution and whatnot. Now I'm just like dude like and I was struck um >> I was struck when I um my grandfather this was years back uh and so it was still when I was an agnostic. >> Yeah. >> I think it was in high school.

¶14My my grandfather died. It's not high school. Sorry. Um it was in college. my grandfather died and at the funeral um the homaly it kind of struck me a little bit and it still has stuck with me to this day and the priest was saying something like you know listen when you go before that seat on judgment day you're not going to be asked about oh yeah how much money did you get or you know accommodating it to my circumstances which venues you published in or which grad institution you went to or that sort of nonsense You're not going to get asked about that.

¶15>> Mhm. >> You're going to get asked, did you love? >> Did you love? >> Mhm. >> And on the basis of that answer, I mean, of course, there are lots of other things, but you know, putting it poetically, on the basis of that answer, you're either going to be going off to the right with the sheep or the left to the goats and your publications.

¶16The venues won't matter at that point, you know? It's like, so, I don't know. It really kind of stuck with me where he just he just said, "Did you love?" like that's what you're going to be asked. And so now I'm like, "Oh man, okay, I need to radically reorient my priorities, my values." Um, you know, at this point, like I'm still I'm trying to like discern what's what God's call is for my life. Like what exact am I even supposed to go into academia?

¶17Like what am I supposed to do? >> Um, so anyway, this is a long preamble. This is this is amazing. Let me let me tell you something that I told you before, but I think relates to what we're talking about here. You know, months ago, we had a private conversation and I I think I told you a bit about my grandfather, right?

¶18Where my grandparents were devout Catholics, beautiful people. Uh my grandfather was I mean, he was a true moral exemplar, right? Never ever paraded himself, always going so far out of his way to to help and love people. And he's the kind of guy that was so humble, yet the line for his his funeral was like wrapping around the building, you know, multiple times, right? Um and um when around the time he died was when I was converting too and I this I think this is the the the part I told you and I was like struggling with like two materialisms at the time right the philosophical materialism that was mostly going away.

¶19Um but where I was really struggling was again this sort of disalignment of values where I still just wanted the material stuff and the material successes. So, my grandfather had a very very nice Rolex that was given to him uh for a gift for his 50th wedding anniversary that was supposed to go to me. Um, and I was excited about that. Like, wow, really nice nice watch, you know, blah blah blah. I was like, and and of course, I love my grandfather, so I wanted it, you know, because it was his and and stuff like that.

¶20But I was excited about like the status symbol of it, too. So, you know, I go finally, you um I take forever to go pick up the inheritance and by the time I get to his house, it's it's all gone. like the Rolex is gone. Nobody knows where it went. I don't know if it was just lost or misplaced.

¶21I I have no idea. It's gone. Right. And then but and they really the only thing left aside from like you know uh mattress frames and dust was up in a room that I used to stay in when I was very little. I had you know my parents were like separated stuff so I stayed at my grandparents house.

¶22It was it was like my room right was just I don't have it with me right here but this little china plate of our blessed mother. And I was like, I submit, Lord. Right. Right. It's like the little this like this is a providential like, you know, sign tailored so profoundly to me that like whatever other arguments I had are just so overwhelmingly overpowered by the way that this was like so meaningful to me, giving my entire backdrop of of of history and my relationship to my grandfather and where I was at in the moment of my conversion that like even though I was intellectually there, this is what really started to facilitate that moral conversion.

¶23And it goes like it it helped me part of the way with the with divine hiddenness too. It's not that God just cares about, you know, that I know he exists. God cares about the way and that I come to relate to him, right? And like this, it was just an interesting sort of personal thing where I realized like, okay, the way that God helped bring about this belief in me was so beautifully situated that it didn't just like change my attitude towards a proposition, but fundamentally reoriented how I want to live my life, right? Um, so I guess that's just a little bit of background just for me of this sorts of stuff we want to talk about today and then how that how to actually go about doing that right once the will is there.

¶24>> So yeah, go ahead. Yeah, anything. >> No, this is good. I mean that is just like the that's conversion like you know as I put it in my um announcement video or whatever um it's a change of mind but also a change of heart, right? And everyone so far has been focused on the change of mind and I'm like yeah that's cool and what not and it's important but I mean more fundamentally what's way more important is the change of heart.

¶25Um and that's like a continual ongoing process. So that that's what we're going to be talking about here is just like cultivating building maintaining the spiritual life. >> So um maybe I can just say a few caveats before we like dive in. Um so you know firstly for the audience >> I'm a neopight right? So you know your physician is himself kind of sick right?

¶26So, just keep that in mind. Um, I'm not trying to pontificate or be like sanctimonious, you know, and not like giving pretensions of holiness. I I'm I'm just here to like share with you guys stuff that I think will be helpful, right? >> Um, and I think I can at least share and systematize things and offer some reflections and encouragements. And that's the goal is service, right?

¶27That's my goal. Um, I fail all the time. Very clear fail fail all the time in the spiritual life. And I desperately need God's grace. Uh, so just want to be like super clear about that.

¶28Uh, and I also don't want to take credit for like this presentation, you know, I'm just like synthesizing stuff from a lot of different sources from like people I've talked to, uh, books I've read, videos I've watched, you know, people I've consulted. Um, >> so, uh, and then I guess the final caveat that I want to issue is that, you know, like we'll be focusing on lots of things that you can do, right? But, you know, I want to be very clear that Catholicism does not teach a natural worksbased salvation, right? Like we're saved entirely by God's grace through faith animated by charity with hope, right? We're not going to get into the nicities about like initial metaphysics of grace and free will.

¶29We'll leave that to Stump and Matthew, right? But I just want to emphasize that like all our, you know, we're going to be talking about various different actions you can do and meritorious actions and whatnot. And all of our meritorious acts under Catholicism, read the Council of Trent, they're grace enabled and grace powered. We cannot do them of our own accord and by our own natural powers. And I think it's like the Council of Orange, which says something like, "No man can claim anything as his own except ignorance and sin." >> Yes.

¶30>> How's that? >> That's all you got, buddy. >> That's Yeah, that's what we That's what we teach, right? Um >> Pelagian or semiplagian friends, don't worry. >> Right.

¶31Yeah. Salvation is by grace through faith. Animated by charity. So not not faith alone, animated by charity. Um together with hope.

¶32Okay. >> So >> with the caveats out of the way, let's just talk about the absolute basics of the spiritual life. Sounds great, Joe. So, like we got to lay the bedrock, lay the foundations first before we build and edifice on top of it. >> Um, okay.

¶33So, I take the the spiritual life to be fundamentally captured in Matthew 22, right? Where, um, I think it's one of the Pharisees comes up to Jesus and says, "Teacher, you know, which commandment in the law is the greatest?" And then Jesus says to him like, "You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, all your soul, with all your mind. That is the greatest and first commandment. And then the second is like it. You shall love your neighbor as yourself.

¶34And the whole law and the prophets depend on these two commandments. Okay. So at bottom the fundamental tenant of the spiritual life is seek to love God above all things and try to be perfect as your heavenly father is perfect and everything else will flow from and be motivated by that charity. Right? >> The greatest of these is love.

¶35You know faith, hope and love remain but the greatest of these is love. So love of God and neighbor is the fundamental tenant of the spiritual life. That's what we're building everything on top of. >> Okay. But then how do we maintain that charity?

¶36Because you can lose your charity, right? Um the supernatural charity, this like you know sanctifying grace that lives in you um and it's like it gives you uh various gifts from God like supernatural faith, hope and love. Um which are profitable unto salvation. Um how do we maintain that charity? Well, you need to maintain the state of grace.

¶37You need to remain you need to keep sanctifying grace in your soul. So I take that to be um the kind of next like element of the superructure that we're building or whatever. So like fundamentally you need to seek to love God above all else and try to you know cultivate manifest maintain supernatural charity in your soul. Um how do you do that? You remain in a state of grace.

¶38Okay. So that's the sort of fundamental task of the Catholic spiritual life like the purgative way as many people talk about is you know get rid of mortal sin stay in the state of grace >> right >> it's like basics 101 we're at that most basic level protein and veggies level right >> yes right exactly um >> okay so the question then is okay how do you do that how do you remain in a state of grace right how do you keep divine life in your soul how do you keep sanctifying grace uh Well, >> don't stamp it out through modal sin, right? So, um well, we'll get to that next. Firstly, of course, you need to immerse yourself in the sacramental life of the church, right? So, you need to get baptized.

¶39>> You need to get baptized. Um you know, you need to get well, okay, I say need, you know, these are like necessities of of um well, they have different necessities attached to them for salvation, but you know what I'm saying? Like, this is what you should do. Get baptized, get confirmed in the Catholic Church when you're of age, >> and go to confession as soon as possible if you have any mortal sins on your conscience. And even if you don't go relatively regularly to receive forgiveness for venial sins and graces to avoid them in the future, you know, I think a lot of people recommend like once a month.

¶40>> Yes. >> Um, right. >> And you know, for for your confession to be valid, if you to get valid absolution, if you need to be truly forgiven from your sins through the the sacrament of reconciliation, you need firstly a firm purpose of amendment. So you need to have a kind of commitment or a firm resolution to avoid sins in the future. And you need true sorrow or contrition for your sins.

¶41You need to be genuinely like repentant, genuinely sorry. Uh and you also need to confess all known mortal sins in kind and at least approximate number and frequency. Okay. >> Um >> okay. So that's like the first step to maintaining the state of grace.

¶42>> The second step is yeah to avoid mortal sin as I said, right? So stamp out mortal sins from your life. Avoid all the near occasions of mortal sins. So like those sorts of circumstances and situations that could lead you very approximately into mortal sin. Um and okay so like I guess we should say something about um what mortal sins are.

¶43Um >> right. Mhm. >> So mortal sins are basically like grave wrongs that you commit with full knowledge and deliberate consent. Okay. So there are three kind of conditions here.

¶44There's grave matter. So it needs to be like a seriously wrong kind of act or omission. Okay. So that's a grave matter. You need to have full knowledge.

¶45So, you need to have um full knowledge and awareness that the actor or omission is seriously wrong. Or at the very least, if you're like ignorant of that, um you know, like you could presumably still be seriously culpable for doing the action if you are seriously culpable for your ignorance of something being morally wrong. You know, if you took a pill that makes you think that murder is okay, like that doesn't get you off the hook, >> right? Yes. Right.

¶46Yeah. Yeah. For those who want more, Ethan and I just went into detail about this this condition on a podcast that will be on this channel by the time this episode goes up. So just go back to that, right? Yeah, let's go.

¶47Sweet. Okay, so um >> grave matter. That's the first condition in mortal listening. Secondly, you need to have full knowledge of its wrongness or at least to be gravely culpable of lacking that full knowledge. Um that's at least my understanding.

¶48And then thirdly, um you need to have deliberate consent. So it needs to be the sort of thing where you don't have freedom, you know, significant freedom mitigating factors. Um you know, you fully deliberate about it. You engage your freedom and consent like you give full consent to the will to it, right? So you perceive that it's seriously wrong, seriously contrary to God's law.

¶49You deliberate about you're like, should I go through with it and then you choose it nonetheless. You stare head. Yeah. You still choose it. Um >> so that's what a mortal sin is and you need to avoid that.

¶50This is the purgative way. This is like one of the most fundamental >> facets of the spiritual life. Avoid mortal sin. Okay. Um so you know like what are some common mortal sins to avoid?

¶51Well uh well I guess I should say common grave matter. Okay. because you know you would still need full knowledge for it to be a mortal sin. But my understanding is that um in addition to like the obvious ones, right? So like obviously you know sorry to get your um podcast demonetized with what I'm about to talk about but this is what murder is going to be on there.

¶52Obviously rape is going to be on there like abortion things like that. Um those are going to be on there. Um but common mortal sins that many people don't recognize are mortal sins that we teach um and that are in fact mortal sins um or grave matter rather are the following. So, intentionally missing mass on Sundays and holy days of obligation without serious reason. Uh, sexual activity outside of the marital act between husband and wife that includes masturbation and watching pornography.

¶53And also intrinsically non-procreative sexual climax within marriage. >> Um, willfully and deliberately entertaining impure thoughts or sexually fantasizing. Um, that's a grave matter. Uh, and I'm not talking here about quick passing thoughts or images or intrusive thoughts or images or you know like fantasies that occur when you're kind of distracted um and before you snap out of it. That's not what I'm talking about.

¶54>> Um, so like you know I I have struggled with scrupulosity in the past and well I still continue to struggle it struggle with it. But this one particular thing through the guidance of a counselor um or a spiritual director and God's grace I've sort of gotten over this hurdle and so I want to be clear for the people who suffer from scrupulosity um >> when you're mentally distracted you're not deliberately willfully entertaining your stream of consciousness right like your will and consent need to be engaged >> before you fall into mortal sin. So like you need to know that you're about to willingly choose to fantasize. >> So like you're not finding yourself in the midst of an involuntary bit of fantasizing while distracted and kind of like passively observing your kind of mental images, right? Um so you need to kind of like know that you're about to willingly choose to fantasize and then go ahead with it anyway despite knowing it's gravely wrong.

¶55And that's a very different phenomenology than what scrupulous individuals are probably thinking of when they worry about impure thoughts. you know, they're probably thinking of when you're like distracted and just like, >> you know, almost like passively observing in a kind of semi unconscious awareness of alluring images before your mind. Like I think we all know what we're talking what I'm talking about. Um, >> and this used to just freak me out that I had like committed a mortal sin. Um, and it was it was kind of tormenting which is unfortunate.

¶56Um, but what I came to realize again through God's grace is that like when that happens, you're not the conductor of that, right? It's like an orchestra. Like you're not the conductor of that. you're kind of just like passively observing it. You're a spectator.

¶57>> Um but when you snap out of it, we all have that moment when you snap out of it. You notice that your mental stream has veered into a bad direction, right? >> Um >> that's when your will is engaged, right? >> And then you can deliberate and say, "I want to go back into that." >> Yeah. Yeah.

¶58Let me go back into that or let me okay, let me just gently steer my direct my uh mental attention other elsewhere or let me just say a prayer or something like that. So now at that point, your will is engaged, right? um before you freely and deliberately choose to continue or direct your attention. So, and only after that point is there mortal sin. That's my understanding.

¶59Okay. And I texted my confessor beforehand >> about this. >> Yeah, >> that that sounds super important and accurate to me. Let me just let me emphasize this is something that I was chatting about with Ethan is like you do not need to be a psychopath to commit moral sin, right? Like like and this this was Ethan's point.

¶60He's I mean he's he's so good and so eloquent, you He said before he was Catholic, he thought, well, if I was Catholic and I believed all the things that Catholics believed, like no way would I ever commit mortal sin. Turns out he was totally wrong about that. And you know, so are all of us, right? It's like there's like, you know, you got to love the way he phrases it. Uh, you know, sometimes it's like, turns out like I am infinitely bad guy, right?

¶61Where I can see that like I'm doing an infinite bad and I still choose to do it anyways. And like this is deeply revealing of the normal human condition, right? So, like what's what's the point of emphasizing this is like don't think that this is something that is like so far off or so far removed that it's not something that um you can afford to not take seriously. That's not right. Exactly.

¶62And when I say all this stuff, like again, don't think that I'm pontificating to you about this stuff, right? Cuz like, >> you know, if you especially if you listen to my general confession, it's like, oh no. Um like not good, not good. You know, I'm a sinner. So, um, just like don't don't take me to be pontificating about this stuff.

¶63It's like, oh yes, I'm beyond these mortal sins. Like, don't don't understand that. Um, okay. So, like I'm just trying to give the audience like some things that you should stamp out of your life, right? Cuz we're still on this most basic task of spiritual life, which is stamp out mortal sin and take this dead seriously, right?

¶64Like your eternal fate is on the line, right? This this is serious stuff, right? This matters. But also, I don't want people to get scrupulous about this, right? Um, like don't just like constantly agonize about whether or not you've committed mortal sin and trust yourself to the goodness and mercy of God.

¶65God does not want you to just He's not trying to get you on a technicality. He doesn't want to damn you. He wants you to experience his forgiveness and his grace. So, just turn to him in humble childlike faith and just entrust yourself to him. Um, Yep.

¶66Exactly. And if if and if you fall into sin, just um try to make an act of perfect condition. Be like, "God, I love you above all things and because of that, I'm sorry for having committed that sin. and I want to go to confession as soon as possible and then just make a resolution. Look up the closest confession time and just go and then trust yourself to God's mercy.

¶67Right. Amen. So, um uh okay. So, like those are some common there are some other ones that are common people need to stamp out of their life. So, like knowingly receiving holy communion in a state of mortal sin >> that is also sacrilegious.

¶68That is a very grave mortal sin. Um making out with someone that you're not married to in such a way that you intentionally excite sexual arousal. That's also a common mortal sin. it doesn't get talked about very much but like uh that sort of like super passionate making out where you are like intentionally exciting or arousing um yourself uh in a kind of sexually sexual manner um even without going to climax that's still a mortal sin. So uh and I'm not saying that you know you can't I think we should be very clear about this.

¶69I'm not saying you can't like chastely kiss your girlfriend for instance. That's not what I'm saying. And I'm not saying you can't like chastely um hug and embrace and whatnot. Um but you know like I think we all know when it gets arous intentionally arousing. So um >> exactly right.

¶70>> So you know that's that's grave matter. Um getting drunk grave matter. Doing other drugs that temporarily compromise your ability to discern right from wrong and truth from falsity. Grave matter. Um harboring like deep hatred for others and wishing very bad things to happen to them.

¶71Grave matter. My understanding. Um serious forms of cheating or lying in school or interpersonal relationships. Um intentionally refusing. So, intentionally refusing to believe an article of the Catholic faith.

¶72That's also grave matter. Um, so, you know, you're like a Catholic, but you're like, "Yeah, I don't really uh, you know, believe what the church teaches about like hell or homosexuality or abortion or something like that." Like, that's that's grave matter. Um, and I'm not talking here about people who may be invincibly ignorant of Catholicism's truth or the duty to become Catholic. Um, and sometimes Catholics also are just like invincibly ignorant, you know, like maybe they don't know that there's a distinction between like the judgment immediately upon death and then like general judgment and resurrection. So like maybe they when asked about that they'd be like, "Oh yeah, no, there's only one judgment." Um, uh, and there they've just denied an article of faith, but like they didn't know, right?

¶73So it's not like >> Yeah. Yeah. Exactly. Right. >> Not like a grave matter.

¶74Um, or not like a mortal sin in that case. Okay, I don't want to go on and on and on about mortal sins and whatnot, but I just want to be very clear because this is an aspect of the spiritual life and it's like one of the most fundamental things is to stamp out mortal sin from your life. So, it's important to go through these and to make people aware that they might be committing mortal sins um that you know they need to start stamping out, right? >> Yeah. It's not just murder that you need to stamp out or >> Yeah.

¶75No. Oh, exactly. And I mean, we're definitely going to see that when we come to the charitable giving stuff. Um >> Yeah. Yeah.

¶76Matthew 25 that the goats in Matthew 25, they weren't described as murderers. Uh they're people who didn't help the poor. So, okay, we'll get to that. >> Um but yeah, so we want to avoid two extremes. One is we want to avoid being too lax, right?

¶77So like, oh yeah, like mortal sin is super super rare. Like you're not going to fall into it. Don't worry. Um, like we need to avoid that extreme, but we also very, and this is for myself, we also very much need to avoid the extreme of like rigorism and like almost like Jansenism where like, you know, God's this like super harsh judge and he's just waiting to like trip you up on a technicality and he's like just almost like waiting in the wings to damn you and like basically, you know, the moment like an alluring image comes into your mind, you're like mortally sinning and you're damned like no, no, no, no, no, no, stop. Like mortal sin is harder than that.

¶78You don't accidentally fall into mortal sin, >> right? Um >> yeah, good point. >> You don't like accidentally stumble into it. Okay. So, >> yeah.

¶79Uh so, just like um >> oh, the third final thing for like the basics of the spiritual life is that everything else we're about to talk about, we're going to get into like building the spiritual life and building the edifice next. Um but everything else we'll talk about will help you remain in a state of grace like prayer, fasting, almsgiving, etc. Um so, I we I've kind of been talking about like maintaining the state of grace so far, but we also want to grow in grace. So that's what we'll get to next. But let me just give like an overview before I turn over to you um of what I just said.

¶80>> So again, we are on the absolute foundation of spiritual life right now. And first and foremost, it is about love of God and neighbor, right? So we want to keep maintain and grow in our love of God and neighbor. Now um in order to do that, we need to not stamp out supernatural charity from our souls, right? We need to need to maintain the state of grace.

¶81Okay? Okay, so that's like the next most like basic task of the spiritual life. Maintain the state of grace. How do you do that? Well, firstly, you participate in the sacramental life of the church.

¶82You get baptized, you know, you get confirmed, you go to confession regularly. Um, and then also you try to stamp out mortal sin and the near occasions thereof from your life. And we went through what mortal sin is and then various common mortal sins that people might not recognize are mortal sins. Um, and then finally, you know, we don't just want to maintain the the state of grace, but we want to grow in grace. So, that's what we're going to get on to next.

¶83But that is just like the absolute basics. That's great, Joe. No, I think that's phenomenal. Let's keep moving. Let's keep the trainer rolling.

¶84Yeah. Sweet. Okay. >> And feel free to interrupt me, Pat, because I know like I've got some notes and I I I um you know, I can sometimes get on >> I will say this, uh you are definitely by far the most prepared podcast guest I ever had. In typical Joe fashion, he sends me like this awesome filled out document, very large, and I read it and it was amazing.

¶85Actually, I don't know if we want to make that available for people afterwards. That could be >> Yeah, we can make it available. We can make it available for >> totally up to you. But what I really loved and we'll get to this. You have this this this sort of the spiritual game plan at the end.

¶86And I have this book coming out in November on on on virtue on on timistic discipline. And I have something similar in my book. Like literally like it's like a game plan. I'm like dang it, Joe is better. >> Can I edit my book real quick?

¶87Right. >> No, >> but they're very similar. So I'll send you mine so you can so you can see it. But it's very funny. Like oh this is great.

¶88But anyway, I can't wait for that book. I'm I'm going to buy that and that'll be part of my Sunday reading. Um >> Oh, gift a gift. I'll send it to you. Don't worry about me.

¶89>> Okay, I can send you. >> Um Okay. So, >> we've laid the foundations for the spiritual life. Now, we need to build on those foundations, right? Cuz we don't just want to maintain the state of grace.

¶90You want to grow in grace. Okay. Um grow in your love of God and love of neighbor, right? Grow closer to God. >> Grow in communion with him.

¶91Okay. So there are three main pillars as I call them of well as the people that I've read call them three main pillars of the spiritual life or maybe they don't uh prayer fasting and almsgiving. Okay. Um and I sort of take these from um Brent Petri's introduction to the spiritual life. Fantastic book.

¶92>> Fantastic book. He's got great stuff around the board. He really does. Yeah. >> Yeah.

¶93Yeah. Brent Petri. >> His Jewish roots series uh the case for Jesus is really great. So yeah, can't get enough of of Dr. Petri.

¶94Yeah, for sure. Yeah, absolutely. Okay. So, prayer, fasting, alms giving the three pillars of spiritual life to help us grow in grace. So, let's start with prayer.

¶95So, what is prayer? Prayer is just fundamentally as the catechism says raising one's mind and heart to God. It's kind of like personal communion with God in some way. Um, now I should say, you know, like the most significant and meritorious worship that we offer to God, uh, is not like these, you know, daily prayers that we participate in. It's the holy sacrifice of the mass, right?

¶96So I I recommend going to mass more often than Sundays if your schedule and state in life allows uh more often than Sundays and holy days. um you know frequently receive the Eucharist which is the source and summit of our faith for a reason right it's Christ there present body blood soul and divinity so um very important to uh you know like attend mass and I think like there's like this quote from Hudp was like if you knew how significant the mass was in God's life you would sorry in God's eyes if you knew how significant that was in God's eyes you would basically be willing to die to attend one mass >> think about that you'd be willing to die to attend a single mass you'd be willing to risk your life to attend a mass. >> So, and like that. Yeah, that has to be true, right? >> Right.

¶97Yeah. Oh, that has to be true. >> And and how many of us I mean, how many of us embody that? I don't embody that, >> right? Exactly.

¶98>> So, how many of us truly embody that? I mean, I want to get there. >> Mhm. >> But I'm not there yet. So, you know, that's why I need to follow this stuff, you know.

¶99Um, >> okay. So, I want to say like at the outset like the mass is very important and I don't want to neglect that. >> Okay. Um, but okay. What are different like modes of prayer?

¶100Cuz I think this is important. Like cuz you know when sometimes when people don't have very significant formation in the faith, they just think like oh you know I just kind of like awkwardly just say a few things to God and like well you know what am I supposed to do? Am I just be like um God uh ha help? And that's better than nothing, right? It is better than nothing.

¶101Yeah. I mean that's based, right? Like that's amazing. Like I'm glad you're doing it. But um you know we can get we can get even better, right?

¶102Thank thanks and help. You can always say thanks and help, right? >> Yes. Exactly. Um, okay.

¶103So, here's like an acronym that I was taught in my youth. Um, acts. Acts. Okay. A C Ts.

¶104Acts. So, A stands for adoration. So, this is where in prayer you adore God. You worship him. You praise his glorious attributes.

¶105You praise his glorious creations. Um, you know, first among which is our blessed mother. Um, you praise Yeah. Just him and his works basically. um you just you adore him and you show him profound love.

¶106Um okay, adoration that's first one. Second one, contrition. So C for contrition. This is where you know you express sorrow for your sins. You ask God to um you know uh cleanse you from all your wickedness, your vices um and you sincerely ask for his forgiveness.

¶107So that's contrition. That's a second mode of prayer. So you can adore God. You can ask for forgiveness. But it's a different thing, right?

¶108These are different things. Um Thanksgiving, that's T. tea for Thanksgiving. So you express gratitude to God for all the manifold gifts that he's given you, the gift of life, the gift of a new day, the gift of socioeconomic stability, the gift of, you know, like living in, you know, I don't know, um, like a democracy where we have like religious freedom and whatnot. Like the gift of his church, the gift of our priests, the gift of, I don't know, of existence, like I mean, the gift of salvation, the gift of his son dying on the cross for us, right?

¶109Because he that's gratuitous. Like we were dead in our sins, right? But he loved us first. Um so yeah thanksgiving that's another one another mode of prayer and then finally s supplication so that's basically just like bringing petitions to God requesting things of God please obtain the conversion of my son God please convert um all the people who are you know maligning me on the internet God please you like that sort of thing um please help me grow in grace you know please help me please stamp out my pride and give me humility you know um show me the way of the cross or please you know like just asking things of God okay so acts, adoration, contrition, thanksgiving, and supplication. And if you just like just think about like, you know, you instead of just kind of fumbling around and awkwardly saying, "Hello, God." You know, like you could just go through that like just start acts.

¶110Okay, adoration. I'm going to start saying some things that are adoring of God. Okay, then contrition. Then I'm going to ask God for to forgive me of my sins and just reflect on those. And then you can sort of go through these and it's like a a spiritual guideline for prayer.

¶111Okay. So, Acts, I think those are the four different modes of prayer that are pretty important. >> Mhm. Now there are three different kinds of prayer that are also important to attend to. Vocal prayer, meditation and contemplation.

¶112Okay. So vocal prayer is basically just like using words to communicate with God. And this could be memorized stuff like the our father, the Hail Mary, the Psalms, etc. Or it could be spontaneous, right? Where you just like verbalize your your thoughts.

¶113Um so that's vocal prayer. >> Secondly, there's meditation, right? So this is basically just like praying with the mind or mental prayer. And like a lot of the saints and you know theologians within our tradition regard mental prayer as like extremely important and just like basically yeah crucial to the spiritual life. Um >> so this is praying with the mind.

¶114Um >> and there are some steps that you can take to kind of immerse yourself within uh meditation or mental prayer. So first you place yourself in God's presence. Ask for the grace of illumination and to have like a fruitful communion with God. Um so place yourself in God's presence. Secondly, pick a subject matter that you're going to reflect on or meditate upon, right?

¶115So maybe it could be a gospel scene. It could be a truth of the faith. It could be a mystery of the rosary. It could be um I mean whatever. So pick a subject.

¶116So you might pick like yeah like the uh the visitation or something like that. And then that'll be your subject for meditation. Thirdly, you reflect on that subject attentively, right? So like just think about the situation. What does this show me about God?

¶117What truths does it reveal about God or his character or his effects? Um what does it reveal to me about myself? Um what is God asking of me when I as I'm reflecting on this? How is this applicable to my life? Right?

¶118Like what can I learn from this mystery or this subject matter? And here like use both your sensory imagination and your intellect to kind of like immerse yourself interiorly in the subject. Right? It's like if we're thinking about the visitation like literally just like uh close your eyes just like imagine yourself there and you're just like literally just like a bystander. You're witnessing Mary um as she's pregnant embracing Elizabeth as she's pregnant and then you know you can almost like see Elizabeth's womb like jiggle a little bit because John is like you know jumping with excitement or something like Yeah.

¶119Yeah. And then like you know immerse yourself with the smells and the sounds and the sight and everything like really kind of imaginatively put yourself in there. Like another one is good for that is like well I mean all of them are good for that but like we we'll do this one when we get to the rosary bit. Um, >> this is great. >> Like, uh, the nativity, you know, like you can smell the animals, right?

¶120Like you smell the animals like, you know, you like reach out and just like feel Christ's hand and like how utterly humble this is that that the creator of the world would become just like this crying pooping baby before you, you know, like, isn't that insane? Um, >> yeah. Yeah, it is. >> So, and just like immerse yourself like you look into his eyes and they're just like these, you know, beautiful blue eyes, so innocent and like Yeah. Anyway, um so immerse yourself imaginatively but also, you know, like intellectually, you know, so like reflect um what exactly does this teach me about um the moral life, about my life?

¶121What is exactly applicable here? Do I need to like become little in some way? Have I become too lofty? You know, do I need to become more childlike? Do I um >> do I exemplify the kind of um well, we'll get to this when we get to the rosary?

¶122But um so anyway, that's what you you do when you reflect on it attentively. So you've placed yourself in God's presence. You've picked a subject. Um you reflected on it attentively using your imagination and your intellect to kind of immerse yourself interiorly in the subject. And then you respond personally to God.

¶123So like how are you going to respond to that? You you've reflected on it, but now you got to kind of respond in some way. So are you going to like adore God? Are you going to um be contrite for something? Are you going to give him thanksgiving?

¶124Are you going to ask for some sort of like yeah a request? Are you going to do supplication? Are you going to like perform an act of trust in God or an act of love? So like this is where you can elicit acts of faith, hope, and love. Where you can um perform those four modes of prayer that I gave earlier, adoration, contrition, thanksgiving, and supplication.

¶125But this is like your response kind of to your reflections in your meditations. Um and then after you respond um personally to God, you can kind of then just like rest quietly with God for some time when words are no longer needed. So so far you've been, and this is kind of actually getting into contemplation a bit. These kind of are supposed to kind of bleed into one another. Um, but we've been you've been very active so far.

¶126You know, you've been immersing yourself in the mystery. You've been thinking about these things. You've been reflecting. Next, you just rest quietly. Rest quietly with God when words are no longer needed, you know.

¶127Um, and just like just place yourself in his presence and be quiet, be still and listen, you know, or just be present. Um, and then if applicable, you don't always have to do this, but if applicable, you can kind of end with a concrete resolution, you know. So, this is where you just put your meditation into action. So, like, okay, yeah, you know what? I insulted that guy today.

¶128Tomorrow I'm gonna go up to his cubicle and I'm gonna be like, I'm gonna apologize to him. Like, hey, I said that rude remark to you yesterday and I'm sorry for that. I should have thought more. Um or or maybe, you know, if if you just said something that was slightly rude behind his back and you, you know, you're not always obliged to like, in fact, you're Yeah. You're not typically obliged to like tell other people when you spoke ill of them behind your back, you could at least go up to them like say something nice to them or like go to the other person.

¶129>> Yeah, exactly. Give them a com or like compliment him to the person that you insulted. So, that's like a resolution. Um, so, okay. So, that's meditation.

¶130You place yourself in God's presence. You ask for his grace. You pick a subject. You reflect on it attentively. You immerse yourself in it.

¶131Um, then you respond to God with those four different modes of prayer and acts of faith, hope and and and love. And then you can kind of rest quietly with God. And then if applicable, um, try to form some kind of resolution. >> Um, >> and then Okay. So, that and I've kind of already mentioned contemplation, but contemplation is the third kind of prayer.

¶132Um, and then I'll turn it over to you for any comments. >> Yeah. Yeah. This is great. Yep.

¶133Mhm. So contemplation at least as defined by Brent Petri is just like a gaze of love between the soul and God. So basically here you're just it's not very active. You're just kind of just resting. You're gazing upon God.

¶134You're kind of just like listening to him. You're seeking his face. You're just yeah resting in silent attentive love of God. So um this is more of like looking and listening and resting over doing. Um, so yeah, that's contemplation.

¶135These are they get kind of mixed because that's very similar to what I said when I said rest quietly with God. But um, yeah, those are the three kinds of prayer and I think that's just like important. Like a lot of Catholics may not have heard of all this stuff and I think it can be helpful to systematize it. >> No, I mean this is amazing. So I don't know if I'm I'm jumping the gun uh on on something we're going to get into here in a bit.

¶136Um, but just as as somebody who is and has been uh a father of many children and and a husband. Um, you know, I've got six soon to be seven, right? Uh, in February we have we have number number seven is and you can see I have some animals in the house too, right? So, it's a there's actually there's I showed Joe before. There's a bass hound right next to me.

¶137So, you see me like squirming around, it's cuz she's down here just doing her bassad hound thing, right? Um, this might sound like, oh man, this is this is this is so much. How do I ever put this into practice? And you don't have to put it all into practice like for hours and hours every single day. But you do need to make a priority of some of this stuff, right?

¶138So, um, the cliches are true, right? The family that prays together, right, stays holy together. So, we we pray with our kids, right? Sometimes we don't get a full rosary in. Sometimes it's just a decade.

¶139Sometimes we're exhausted. But we can you can squeeze it in on car rides, right? Uh when you're taking them to their swim lessons are back. That's a great time when everyone's there to get the prayers done, carving out a bit of time to take them to adoration. Basics like grace before meals, you know, um prayers to guardian angel, prayers before bed, and then even when the when the kids are in bed, me and my wife always say prayers together uh before we go to bed as well.

¶140And of course, you know, mass and and regular confession and stuff like that, too. So just finding ways to make sure this is just infused into your life and and part of your daily routine. Um it it it it does not and and should not feel like some enormous mountain you have to climb every day. Just just just build it into your routine always. I think starting the day with prayers, ending the day with prayers, you know, having having as much as you can in between is fantastic.

¶141And um I mean we do catechism with the kids at dinner, you know, we sometimes we'll take out the old catechisms and and and just and just have spiritual conversations >> like reading the Council of Trent like aniz and the kids the kids love it because it's like Q&A format like the Baltimore Catechism Q&A format. So like they love getting the questions like they get excited about it, right? Uh and they sometimes get competitive sometimes we have to say okay not too competitive, right? Um but it's just stuff like this just maybe that just some some helpful practical ways to see that this could be integrated even with an otherwise very busy family life. Yeah.

¶142So >> that's all for me on that. >> No, that's really good. And later on we'll talk about Yeah. Um how to try to integrate this stuff with, you know, your daily life and commitments and whatnot. But yeah, I mean like it's actually real quick.

¶143I mean just just for you Joe, I mean just from where you are at in your state of life, you know, grad student, super busy. Um I don't know what the entire culture is like. I know there's like a strong Catholic contingent at at Princeton, but still obviously very secular. So I just give us a little bit of like how you've restructured everything with where you are uh since your conversion. Just be curious to hear that a little bit.

¶144>> Mhm. >> Yeah. Yeah. So I guess like I have tried to make like one thing that I've tried to make non-negotiable and we'll talk about this um in a second, but I just I try to make non-negotiable daily rosary. Okay?

¶145like whatever else I do, I've got to get in the daily rosary. I mean, I'm not saying this is like a church precept or that you know, you got anyone is sinning or whatever, like you know, but for me, I love our blessed mother. I have a special devotion to our blessed mother. And I just think daily rosary, whatever else I do, that's I've got to get in a rosary, you know. Um, so just making that like a staple.

¶146It kind of just like keeps me grounded and it gives me cuz the rosary is meditative and it allows me to kind of immerse myself in the mysteries. Um ultimately, you know, like you can have scripture in front of you, but like you it's just like it's all scriptural basically for the most part. Um so, you know, just like I'm kind of meditating on scripture as I do it, the various, you know, elements that are described in the mysteries and the gospels. Um and it allows me to kind of kind of hit all these hit all these topics that we've talked about. You know, it allows me to um elicit those acts of faith, hope, and charity.

¶147it allows me to um participate in both adoration and contrition and thanksgiving and supplication because you know you sort of do that as you're going through the the mysteries and whatnot. Um so that's been something that's been very very helpful for me. So that's one way in which I've kind of I've tried to just carve that out every day. Um often times it's just like before bed. Um and then also you know I have this like regimen of um prayers that I do upon waking right so there are various different prayers that kind of just like set the tone for the day and I've tried to make it non-negotiable that Joe before you do anything for the day >> or you have a sip of coffee that's that's like my my very pathetic selfification I don't even get a sip of coffee till I get at least a few my the basic of the prayers done right exactly so like I've just got it I've got it on my notes on my phone and I you know I'm not allowed to check notifications before that.

¶148I literally you wake up, the the alarm goes off. Okay, turn the lights on, get my water, start sipping my water as I open up my phone and go directly to the morning prayers thing. It's like, okay, I got to get these in before I do anything else. Um, and so you do the morning prayers and okay, that's like that's already setting me up very well. I've got that in the morning and then in the evening I've got my rosary and then, you know, just like sprinkled throughout all that is like, you know, I try to do things throughout the week.

¶149Um, you know, of course, obviously Sunday mass, but I like I mean, we we have just we are spoiled here at Princeton with our Catholic community because we have like mass every single day just right on campus. It's like right in the heart of campus and it's relatively short. It's like noon to like it's like 12:00 to 12:20 m. Those are great. Yeah.

¶150>> Yeah. No, I Right. And so, I mean, listen, I don't go daily. Um, right now I go every Friday we have adoration from 11 to 12 and then from 12 to like 12:30 there's mass. Um, and so I try to go just every Friday to and there's confession during adoration.

¶151So I just try to go to adoration, confession if applicable, and then mass. I try to do that um, every Friday. >> So that's how I've kind just tried to restructure my life. Um, and there, you know, various other things and whatnot that we don't need to get into, but um, there's another point there that's great is that there's already a community there that you plug yourself into. And I can't emphasize this enough and this is one of the difficult things about conversion is that so much of your environment will and sort of has to change right um and the sorts of people that you regularly surround yourself with that matters.

¶152I mean so so you know now um we moved right so after shortly after we converted we moved so I guess this this helped a lot but uh even when we converted like we we sort of naturally lost certain connections and and friendships and stuff um that does that does happen and that's difficult and sometimes you can see why that is um perhaps necessary but also making sure that you surround yourself with other faithful Catholics and communities it helps make sure that you're not constantly working against your environment, but hopefully in some way your environment is working with and for you as well. >> Yeah, >> that's something that's super helpful is just like yeah, I mean the community aspect. So like no and I we try to go together when we can on Fridays. >> Um so you know we're like both there both going to mass and sometimes we'll go afterwards and get our favorite like vegan meal or something like that. Um, so it was, you know, was one of the first times somebody was talking about confession is like if you're really nervous, like that's okay.

¶153Just go and get an ice cream sundae afterwards. I'm like, hey, you know, >> I mean, yeah, give yourself a little carrot there. There's nothing wrong with that, >> right? Right. Exactly.

¶154Go to Dairy Queen, right? >> Exactly. So, speaking of the rosary, uh, sorry, No, it's all good. No, no, that's good. That's good.

¶155Um, cuz we're still in this like prayer aspect, right? Cuz remember the three pillars. cuz I don't want us to lose track of the dialectic the three pillars of the spiritual life you know prayer fasting almsgiving and right now we've gone through the different kinds of prayer how mass is like the the most significant and efficacious thing we can we can do as a as Catholics so I highly recommend you know attending mass um but let's get on to the rosary because this has a particular place in my heart beautiful so I've got my my rosary here it's like an eastern Byzantine kind of rosary >> yeah beautiful >> uh yeah I think missing opportunity to give. Let me say plug Catholic woodworker. Imagine I'm holding one of their rosaries right now.

¶156They sent me a bunch of really nice ones. So >> Oh, nice. I think this one is from some like Runewood rosary company or something like that. And there's actually like a really cool there's like such a base pair on the back. I mean uh but anyway um >> so yeah.

¶157So what is the the rosary? Well, fundamentally it is you know five different decades of vocal prayer uh coupled with meditation on various mysteries when you go through the decades. Okay. So you know on different days you'll have a different like set of mysteries to um you know reflect on or meditate upon and you know they like it's like co coordinated. So like you know on Sunday you'll have the glorious mysteries cuz that's when Christ was resurrected.

¶158On Friday you'll have the sorrowful mysteries where you reflect on Christ's passion and death for obvious reasons cuz that happened on a Friday like on Thursday you'll have the luminous mysteries and whatnot. Uh Monday you'll have the joyful mysteries. So um yeah so like fundamentally I think this is something that a lot of people miss about the rosary. This is meditation, right? It's not fundamentally about the vocal prayer.

¶159And in fact, like I hardly even pay attention to the vocal prayers when I'm doing it, you know? So like, yeah, I'm saying the point of the vocal prayers is to kind of just like immerse yourself in this like aura of like prayer, right? So it's like it's almost like to keep your mind focused on the meditation and to surround yourself with vocal prayer so that you free up your mind for the contemplation of divine mysteries, right? >> The mysteries. Yeah.

¶160Exactly. >> Yeah. So it's fundamentally meditative. This is not supposed to be wrote um just like memorized prayer. You're supposed to be like really actively thinking about and immersing yourself in these mysteries.

¶161So like >> uh you know we can take we can take an example. So like >> uh let's take the the visitation one that we talked about earlier. So this is the uh the second joyful mystery and um basically you know at the beginning of each decade I will have like an intention right. So I might have as an intention the conversion of person X or you know like the the gift of final perseverance or you know whatever. Um and they'll say yeah I'll just say I offer this decade up for that.

¶162>> And then you um then you announce the mystery. So you'll say the second joyful mystery is the visitation and then you pray the one our father 10 hail Marys a glory be and then the fatima prayer and then you're on your way. So like what do you think about when you're doing this? Well, you just engage in the the whole meditative process that I mentioned, right? >> So, with the visitation >> there, >> these mysteries are so rich.

¶163It's insane. Like seriously, like just >> because you can think about things that were like happened immediately before it and things that happened immediately afterwards if you you know you're familiar with some of like the scriptural passages like just with the visitation alone, right? Um I mean firstly and you can even pick up on like very tiny things in the passages but um so like one thing here is like she goes Mary goes to visit Elizabeth in haste. That's how it's described I think in Luke. She leaves in haste.

¶164Okay that's really interesting. Why is she leaving in haste? Okay. So now just like think about that. Um well you know as Bishop Baron has put it she's kind of discovered her role in the theod drama, right?

¶165Like so there's this like this divine drama playing out which is distinct from the ego drama like with me at the center of things. There's there's the drama going on with God at the center. And so she's discovered her role in the theodo drama that's been just revealed to her in the previous mystery. Um you can kind of like connect up the mysteries as well. Okay.

¶166So she's discovered her role in the theodrama and now she wants to put into action. So she she's going out in haste. She's doing she's super diligent, right? So this is like she's she's zealous. She's diligent.

¶167She's going out in haste to go and see Elizabeth and care for her in her old age. Right? So that's interesting. Like in what ways am I going out in haste um after receiving my call, after receiving my conversion, am I failing to go out in haste? Am I being negligent?

¶168Am I being kind of slothful? Am I being lazy in various ways? Um so like, okay, I focused on one word here and you can see it's just spiraling out of control. Yeah. And uh and then you can focus on other parts of the mystery, right?

¶169So like, okay, she's going out in haste. I mean, dude, what? She's like going out. She's pregnant herself, right? And you know what pregnancies are like?

¶170Like you're probably pregnant wife right now, >> right? You like you're nauseous, you've got headaches and whatnot, but what is she doing when she's she's nauseous, she's got headaches and all this stuff, she's caring for others. She's putting others before herself. Even when she has nausea and maybe even she like vomited along the way, like you can imagine. I mean, I I don't mean to like be kind of gross, but like just think about how self-sacrificial this is.

¶171>> Mhm. that like she just discovered that she's pregnant, but also a person who's older than her is pregnant and may very well need help. Well, what does she do? She immediately gets up and sacrifices her own body, her own discomfort, even when she's uncomfortable to go and care for someone else, right? I mean, it's it's it's just in what ways do I sacrifice my comfort very significantly when I'm nauseous or what and whatnot, for instance, to go and help other people?

¶172Well, no, I'm usually just focused on myself. Um, so like okay, in what ways can I kind of like imitate that? um radical charity and a radical love of neighbor um even when I don't want to, even when I'm feeling bad. Um and then, okay, you know, that's just her going out when she's pregnant. There are other aspects of this, you know?

¶173So, like she meets Elizabeth. Well, what happened to Elizabeth? Well, Elizabeth is in super old age, right? And God graced her with the son. So, like anything is possible for God, right?

¶174That's kind of what this is telling us. Anything is possible for God. Okay. So, in what ways am I kind of like resistant in my life to thinking that anything is possible for God? Am I kind of like despairing over someone's salvation?

¶175Am I despairing over my own salvation? Um uh am I thinking that you know someone's conversion is impossible? Have I failed to pray for someone you know? Um and like do I trust in God enough to think to agree with him that anything is possible to agree with him that you know um miracles like that can happen? Um so you know that's just the fact that Elizabeth became pregnant.

¶176But then there's also the meeting or the communion between them that happens in this mystery, right? So um you know there's a kind of like beautiful embrace between them. Um, and John the Baptist uh jumps for joy in Elizabeth's wombs. Like what what is that signaling to? Well, I mean this kind of can go back to I mean there's just so much here.

¶177You could think about the typology between Mary and Mary being the new arc of the covenant. You could think about um >> like how joyful am I when you know I see Christ? Am I that joyful when I go to mass? Am I that joyful when I get the chance to pray instead of viewing it as like a you know a burden or a task? Um am I Uh, and also what's interesting is that I think he jumps at joy at Mary's voice, right?

¶178It's that Mary's voice that he kind of jumps for joy. So that's interesting. Am I excited about the blessed mother, too? So it's not just um Christ that we need to get excited about and and you know, venerate. We also need to venerate and pay attention to the blessed mother.

¶179And so like and there's so much more that you could go into. I mean, I've just scratched the surface, but this is a mystery. This one, and dude, we haven't even gotten into the Magnificat yet cuz that's the next part of like this mystery. So like you could just see how these are endless endless sources of reflection. Um and dude the magnifica is just like you know my soul proclaims or magnifies the greatness of the Lord.

¶180My spirit rejoices in God my savior for he has looked with kindness on his lowly servant. He's cast down the mighty and the arrogant from their thrones and he's lifted up the meek and the lowly. Like there's so many things there to reflect on. It's like oh my gosh in what ways am I arrogant? You know how can I transpose this into my life?

¶181like um does my soul magnify the glory of God? What does it exactly does it mean to magnify or proclaim the glory of God? And then yeah, I mean so I just wanted to pick one example and just show you the sorts of things you can do with the rosary, right? Um this is where your mind goes and you reflect on it and you apply it to your personal life and you immerse yourself in the mystery and sometimes you just literally just sit there and hug Mary, you know, like you could do a bunch of different things. Um so >> yeah.

¶182Um man, all of these are just so rich. Uh, and yeah, you can think about their theological implications, too. I was I was talking about like the new arc typology and um there there's all sorts of interesting parallelisms between like the the months and what happened with David and the Ark of the Covenant. So, anyway, um >> and Petri is great on all that stuff. >> Oh, right.

¶183Exactly. Yeah. Um yeah, >> so that's the rosary and I just think it's like this massively underutilized weapon and I strongly encourage >> I love the deep love you have for the rosary. Of course. Yes.

¶184I can I can get you right. >> Yeah. And I just want to pray the rosary. >> Yeah. Everyone pray the rosary and and um you know my wife >> a far holier person than I.

¶185And like thank thank God I thank God for her every day. You know she does a rosary for every member in addition to all of her other prayers. She does a rosary for like each particular member of her family on a on a day per week. So this is like a great discipline just for parents too. So you have lots of kids, right?

¶186You want to pray for all. like, you know, Monday is Marin's day, Tuesday is Ran's day. I I get I I she even gives old dad a day there, right? So, you know, just another another, you know, kind of practical application there. >> Yeah, dude.

¶187That's also the thing because like, dude, you're just like constantly praying for things that are like very good ends to pray for, right? Cuz like you can firstly offer up the whole rosary for someone. Um, but then in addition to that, >> you can have particular intentions indexed to particular decades. Like, yeah, exactly. got an entire decade of the rosary dedicated >> to a particular person or to a particular thing or particularly solitary end or particular grace >> and you get to do that five times every single day.

¶188I mean just think about all the graces that can come out as a result of that. I mean it's insane. So like yeah I strongly strongly strongly strongly encourage without obliging but I strongly strongly strongly encourage every single Catholic to pray at least one decade of the rosary a day. Um, and you know, I recommend given your state in life, again, you'd have to be credential. I recommend a rosary day, but again, think about your state in life.

¶189I I I certainly don't want to oblige people to that. >> Yeah. Yeah. Great job. >> Okay.

¶190>> So, that's that's one prayer that I highly recommend. Another prayer that I highly recommend is um a kind of prayer is uh Lexio Deina. >> Now, you know, full disclosure, this is something I focus more on the rosary than Lexio Deina. I would like I should be doing Lexio Deina. Um but anyway, I I'll just talk about what it is.

¶191It's basically just prayful meditative scripture reading. Yeah. >> Um so there are four steps to it. You know, firstly like you read a passage. So you know I would recommend like one paragraph or like two paragraphs or something like that.

¶192You know, relatively small. Um read it very slowly, carefully and deliberately. Okay? And read it through a first time >> and let it wash over you and then maybe read it through again. Right?

¶193So like read it through a second time. >> Mhm. Um and then meditate right so go through those steps of meditation that I mentioned. So ponder what you've read. Kind of place yourself there.

¶194What's sticking out to you. What is you know striking you? What might be God can what might God can be communicating to you through this particular passage? What can you learn? Um just like reflect on that and then you know pray talk with God from the heart about the fruits of your meditation.

¶195Uh and then contemplate right so then be still and gaze upon God quietly resting in his presence. So it's basically just like applying all the meditative stuff to a particular passage. Right. Yes. See that like you just go back to meditation and when I said pick a subject um just pick a passage and then like read it twice let it wash over you and then engage in all those steps.

¶196Um okay so that's Lexio Deina. Um a few other things that I want to mention before we get on to uh uh fasting cuz you know we're still on the different pillars of the spiritual life. Um >> firstly don't neglect adoration right so like spend time with Jesus in front of the blessed sacrament. Right? So that's another important kind of prayer.

¶197Um that I would highly recommend um maybe try to do that weekly or monthly or something like that. >> Yeah. >> Um I mean even better if you get to do it every day. I mean I know lots of people like Bishop Fulton Sheen recommended like a daily holy hour. I mean that would be very amazing.

¶198Um you know I I should try to do that but u uh but yeah no I there uh may maybe not with my state in life. I'd have to think about that. But anyway, I recommend adoration and then Okay, so like um I'll I'll end with a game plan and just some things not to forget. >> Perfect. So here's a game plan, like a kind of plan of action for y'all.

¶199Firstly, I at least recommend praying at least 15 to 20 minutes a day. So just like my recommendation, I'm not saying this is church precept, but my recommendation is to make that a minimum goal. Maybe you have to build up to it. That's okay. But I mean, dude, this is like God we're talking about.

¶200This is eternity. This is the most significant thing. And like we'll talk about this later when we talk about pride. But dude, like for me, the daily rosary is like the most meritorious and most important thing that I do in any given day. More important than any of my other activities, more important than my, you know, my job, like you know, like praying like it matters.

¶201Like this is important. Your relationship with God is the most important thing, right? So I very I very strongly recommend without obliging that you pray at least 15 to 20 minutes a day and wake up earlier if you if you have to right prayer is like exercise you know if you want to grow physically strong and and be healthy you know you exercise daily and you don't just do it for like 2 minutes right um >> yes it's a >> if you want to grow spiritually right and if you want to grow spiritually then like you know and you want to be holy you got to pray daily just like you got to exercise daily and not just for a short duration right >> so um yeah so that that's that's the first part of the game plan um I would also say pray firstly immediately upon waking right it sets the tone of the entire day so like what to pray well I mean it again it depends on your state in life and how much time you have you could do just like a decade of the rosary that's like two to three minutes short bit of meditation at the beginning of the day you could you know do a bit of lexioina at the beginning of your day for 10 minutes you could >> I mean there are all sorts of things you know you could do the morning offering you know um lots of other prayers that you could say and just memorize for the beginning of the day um so pray immediately upon waking I would also pray immediately before sleeping so you You could consider a nightly examine. A lot of people recommend that. And um >> Sure.

¶202>> One uh acronym that's helpful here is Baker. B A K E R. Baker. This is the one I wish I had for my book. Yeah.

¶203>> Well, I got this from um >> and this might even go back to St. Francis to Sales, but um it's in the appendex of this uh 33 days to morning glory. It's like a preparation for total consecration to Mary. Um, >> yeah. >> Or, you know, if I I I want to be PC, total consecration to Jesus through Mary.

¶204But I think, you know, us Catholics are properly catechized, so we understand what we're saying when we say fully consecrating myself to Mary. >> Um, >> okay. >> So, um, Baker B. So, like just, you know, this shouldn't be too long, but like, you know, when you're right before going to bed, you can do this nightly exam. So, B, that stands for blessings.

¶205So, praise and thank God for the many blessings of your day, including the crosses, right? So, like what are some of the good things that happened? What are some of the like the the peaks? Not the troughs, the peaks. What are some of the good things?

¶206Praise God for those. Those are the blessings that you got. >> A ask. So then you just ask the Holy Spirit for the grace to recognize your sins. So now you're moving into examining your conscience for the day.

¶207Um so A, ask the Holy Spirit for the grace to recognize your sins. K, that stands for kill, right? Our sins killed Christ and we need to kill our sins, right? So um reflect on those times in that particular day where you failed or where you sinned or were weak or where you were too attached to something. Did you fail to forgive someone?

¶208Um were you impatient? Did you gossip about someone? Did you insult someone? Did you fail to accept a traffic jam as a small sharing in Christ's cross? >> Um >> so K is kill just to kill those you know inclinations to sin and also our weaknesses and sins and failures and whatnot.

¶209Um E is embrace. So now you just allow Jesus to embrace us, embrace you with his merciful love, right? So you ask for forgiveness for your sins. Uh and you just let Jesus embrace you and fold you. Um that's what gives him joy, right?

¶210Uh so E stands for embrace. You let God embrace you after you ask forgiveness for those sins. Um and then R. So R stands for resolutions. So take what you've learned both about your blessings and your failures and then just like make resolutions going forward.

¶211So yeah, to return to previous analogy, like yeah, go up to that guy that you insulted and give him a compliment tomorrow or something like that, you know. Um, okay. So Baker, that's like a good acronym for a nightly examine. Um, now I think I've heard people say like for scrupulous individuals, maybe maybe don't do a daily examination of conscience because unfortunately um we or at least I am almost just like constantly examining our consciences, right? And just like it's just like an everpresent annoyance.

¶212Um, so maybe for people who are scrupulous or who at least lean that way, just like reflect on your blessings throughout the day or something like that, you know, just like thank God and focus on the good things. Um, and trust in God, you know, do acts of faith, hope, and love. Um, okay. >> So, that's what I, you know, that's one thing I could recommend. Um, right before bed using Baker as your nightly examine.

¶213Um, and then, yeah, throughout the day, pray before meals. So, just say grace before you eat anything, including a snack. Um, >> and yeah, so that's like, okay, that's my game plan is like pray immediately upon waking, pray before bed, and then pray throughout the day before meals. Um, some things not to forget. So I think some Catholics might forget saintly intercession.

¶214So like, yeah, listen, like there's this >> huge cloud of witnesses out there who are who want to help you, who can help you, right, if you ask. So I would recommend building a kind of prayer posi in heaven, right? So >> absolutely right. >> Yeah. You've got some of your favorite saints and people who touched you, you know, like I've got my icon of Maxmillian KBY up there.

¶215I've got icons of my um patron saint, my confirmation saint St. Albert the Great. I've got um St. Mary Grey, St. Charbal here, um and various other people who help with like scrupulosity, right?

¶216So like um St. Terza Lzour, um uh St. Alfonsus Lori, um you know, Padre Pio was instrumental in my conversions and he's part he's part of my prayer posi. Mhm. >> Um but yeah, just like build your prayer posi in heaven and just like ask them for intercession for particular things.

¶217>> Um >> don't forget your guardian angel. >> Um that's another thing not to forget. Just like you could pray that. Um >> and then like and seriously too, right? No, exactly.

¶218I mean seriously, especially when I Yeah. Whenever if you're struggling with um >> intrusive thoughts and stuff like that, uh prayers for your guardian angel. Highly highly recommend. I can't I can't move right now. um pinned by the bassad hound, but you would see that we've got a fair bit of religious art, including of saints, around our house.

¶219And speaking of the the bassad hound, you know, she had an issue with her eye the other day. We just said a little prayer to St. Francis and now she's doing great. So, yep. Beautiful.

¶220Even the pets could be opportunities to bring in your prayer. >> Indeed. I like it. >> Indeed. Right.

¶221Exactly. Oh, and like St. Anthony, if you know you lost something grandma, right, >> Exactly. Um, you know, like for the guardian angel thing, I mean, I'd, you know, just wake up and be like, say the the kind of cute little rhyme prayer. Um, and you could just say like, "Guardian angel, please protect me from any mortal sin today, you know." Um, >> so and then that'll obtain for you graces.

¶222So, um, okay. And then another thing that I think people might forget is like just aspir. So, these are called aspirations throughout the day. Just these short little prayers that you say either verbally or in your mind. Um, just kind of throughout the day and spontaneously and when the moment arises.

¶223So, here are some examples of that. like Lord Jesus Christ, son of God, have mercy on me a sinner. Um or just like praise God or like thank you God or Jesus Mary and Joseph I love you or Jesus Mary and Joseph make my heart like unto thine or come Holy Spirit or just like these short little prayers you can kind of get into the habit of saying um >> and then finally don't forget sacramentals right so don't forget crucifixes and holy water icons and religious art I I don't know I love those literally I just got this Our Lady of Kazan icon today it's very beautiful >> beautiful yeah get your house blessed get your kids blessed get your get your dogs, cats, bless. >> Exactly. Um but yeah, I mean listen like just having these things around um physical and aesthetic beauty is itself like a small encounter with the transcendent, right?

¶224And it can just sanctify little moments. It's like >> it's like little moments where the sacred kind of erupts into the profane. Uh and in that way they're all just kind of like >> multi-day encounters with the sacred and the holy and the spiritual and the transcendent and and that can I think be spiritually salutary. Um yeah, and as I told my friend once who was um he was kind of flirting with Protestantism a little bit and he had some worries about um just like sacramentals and various other things like that. Uh and just struggling to understand like justifications for them like why like why do we have holy water and you know that sort of thing.

¶225Um now there are lots of reasons for that. You know God just loves using secondary causality. It like dignifies creatures to kind of involve them in bringing about spiritually solutary ends. But I mean, I just think like another thing it's like, dude, complete honesty. Are you more or less likely to masturbate if you've got like a dozen pictures of the blessed mother in front of you and a rosary bracelet and like holy water that you just dipped your hand in?

¶226Are you more or less likely? Come on, be honest. Right. So, like these things help with the the more life and spiritual. >> Yeah.

¶227We're physical embodied creatures. These things are fitting, right? Yeah. Uh-huh. >> Yeah.

¶228There's there's always been a beautiful fittingness. Joe, as you know, for years, I was always struck by various fittingness arguments for more than that, of course, for the case, but fittingness was always um had a strong pull on me. So, yeah. Great, Joe. Yep.

¶229Yeah. And we're physical like lurggical creatures. Like, it would be bizarre if God like instituted a religious system and just like neglected that like >> um you and just think like we we don't we don't think of this way in any other context, right? Like think about even secular weddings. They're overwhelmingly lurggical and they involve oftentimes these little like quoteunquote sacramentals, you know, like they'll oftentimes have these like ropes that they tie together and symbolism all suffused throughout.

¶230Yes. >> Um and and it's again it's super lurgical and you like stand at certain points, you turn at certain points, like you say certain wrote memorize formulas and um so yeah anyway um and like we keep locks of hair of each other and like we keep little trinkets. Anyway um okay so that's prayer. I don't know if you want to add anything, but that's like the first pillar of the spiritual life is to pray. This is super important.

¶231Uh, anything to add? >> Nothing that I've I've added you. I'm trying to I mean, you're doing a wonderful job, so I'm just trying to maybe offer something from like the perspective of old dad and husband here or there, but uh I've already already added that. So, yeah. Continue.

¶232Yep. Mhm. Oh, sweet. Okay. Next up is fasting and mortification.

¶233So, this is the second pillar of the spiritual life. >> Mhm. >> Okay. So, what are these? Well, these as in fasting and mortification, these are voluntary acts of self-denial or acceptance of discomfort that are offered to God in love as spiritual sacrifices.

¶234>> Mhm. >> And they can serve as a kind of like meritorious secondary causes of grace. And I I say secondary because you know they merely like apply or channel the graces that Christ himself merited through his passion. These are not additional sources of grace. Like none of us are like underived sources of grace.

¶235Instead, we are just like the mirrors that like reflect the sunlight when the sunlight, you know, the sun is the primary source of light and it kind of beams down upon us and we direct it and reflect it in various ways. So, um, you know, mirror is a mirror can in some sense be a cause of light, right? You can like >> turn a mirror some way and you can illumin something that wasn't previously illumined, right? >> Um, so likewise, we can kind of like direct Christ's merits in certain ways and apply them. Um but it's wholly through his merits and he's the primary unervative source and we're kind of like applying them and channeling them as kind of secondary meritorious causes.

¶236We're not additional sources of grace. So okay um and that's why we say like we unite them to his passion, right? We we we like by voluntarily foregoing pleasure or taking on some kind of discomfort or suffering, we kind of turn these acts into prayer and we can um you know crucify our flesh and we can make up in our body what is lacking in Christ's afflictions um through uniting those uh sufferings or discomforts and whatnot and self-denials to Christ's passion. Yes. Um and like ultimately, you know, some people are just like confused like why why why do I have to suffer, you know, like what is it or like why do I have to be uncomfortable?

¶237But like dude, this is one of the means that God instituted by which we can spiritually aid one another out of love. What is love? Love is a gift of self to another. And it manifests profound love when you serve others through some cost to yourself, either of time or comfort or whatever. And that's why greater love hath no one than this, that a man lay down his life for his friends.

¶238And so fasting and mortification are ultimately a form of just laying down your life for others by putting them and their intentions above your own pleasure or comfort or time or what have you. Yeah. >> like like a glorious facet of God's uh providential economy and his um economy of grace that we can spiritually aid one another through these acts these voluntary acts of self-denial these gifts of self to another. And ju I mean just think about that like I you can help someone on the other side of the planet even though you can't go there and physically help them. you can spiritually help them by skipping breakfast and you might obtain additional graces for them um that are spiritually solitary that bring about a conversion for example a conversion of heart um >> so I don't know I just think that's like insanely cool this is this is another means by which we can help other people um >> and you know if God gave us that kind of differencem responsibility for how each other's lives go in the physical domain why wouldn't he give it to us in the spiritual domain as well >> so Yeah.

¶239Um, so that's like one of the motives or kind of ends of fasting and mortification, but I think it accomplishes several other ends. So, you know, firstly, it disciplines the flesh, right? So, it curbs our tendency towards sin and overindulgence and it kind of it kind of disciplines our soul to be kind of apt to rule the flesh. >> Yes. >> Secondly, it frees the soul for the contemplation of God because you're kind of detaching yourself from created goods.

¶240>> Mhm. >> Thirdly, it can make satisfaction for sins. So that's basically just like freely accepting or undertaking hardship united to Christ's passion in love in order to repair the disorder that's caused by our sins and to kind of discharge the temporal punishment due to it. Um you know like David after he committed his sin he was forgiven by God but there were some remaining leftover consequences and punishments for his sin that was that were still meed out to him. Um and it's it's something very similar that happens in the spiritual life.

¶241Um, so it can make satisfaction for sin and basically just like restore the disorder that our sins have caused and repair the damage that we've caused and repair our relationship with God. Um, and then finally, as I've said, it can just be a secondary cause or merit uh grace for various salutary ends. Um, like conversions, growth and virtue, things like that. >> So that that's like some of some of the reasons why we fast and mortify. Um, >> let's talk about like what Catholics are obliged to do in terms of fasting and mortification.

¶242Uh because like again I want to get clear on like firstly there are things that we're like obliged to do and then there are things I like recommend which go beyond the obligations. So in terms of fasting and mortification my understanding is that every Friday is a mandatory penitential day for Catholics. So you know you should be taking on some sort of penance every Friday. I think it used to be the case that like you were required to abstain from meat on Fridays. I think the US Conference of Catholic Bishops has abregated that particular um uh requirement but I think they've put in its place uh just a general requirement to do some sort of penance on Friday.

¶243Yes. Right. So it could be an additional prayer or it could be you know that you wouldn't otherwise have done and done in a spirit of penance or you know it could be you know taking a cold shower or it could be you know >> giving up certain foods or whatever. Um so that that's one thing that I think a lot of Catholics might not be aware of that like Friday is a penitential day guys. Um, okay.

¶244So, secondly, in terms of our obligations, um, and that's at least my understanding. People can correct me if I'm wrong. There's a really good video by Kateus Vids on this. And so, uh, I recommend people watch that. Um, but anyway, uh, in terms of other obligations the Catholics are required to fulfill, Ash Wednesday and Good Friday are mandatory fasting days for ages 18 to 59.

¶245Um, and so the church allows one full meal on those days, two small meals that do not together comprise a full meal. >> See the bigger meal, right? Yeah. >> Yeah. And then no meat.

¶246Um and also no meat on Fridays in Lent for ages 14 up. >> Um so those are those are just like minimal bounds. Okay. Um I recommend going beyond the minimum. >> Yeah.

¶247Who wants minimal flare, right? >> Right. Given your state in life, right? So here we need to be very credential. You know, don't go overboard.

¶248Um you need to be very credential. Consider your state in life. Consider what would hamper your ordinary duties and what wouldn't. Um >> and think about exercise again, right? just like minimal thing like hey you want to be healthy like minimally do this right get some good sleep watch your calories take some you know moderate amount of like we all kind of know what the minimum is but like I would recommend right >> yeah maybe lifting some weights right getting rid of the soda right so on and so forth >> right >> running whatever else right right you're not like you're not you know obliged to do it But it it can help a lot.

¶249Yeah, for sure. Uh-huh. Yeah. So, like here are some just good ideas cuz people might be looking for ideas. Like here are some good ideas that you could um implement for fasting and mortification.

¶250So, I've broken these down into a bunch of different categories. So, firstly, food and drink related ideas. Okay. So, I'm just going to go quickly so people can just get an idea. You could skip a snack or dessert.

¶251You could skip a meal. You could skip food all day. Um you're going to have to be very careful with that one for your state in life, but you know, okay, you could do that. Um, you could eat intentionally later than normal. So, you could like wait until 3 p.m.

¶252to eat. Or like you normally eat at 6 PM and it could be really annoying to wait till 7 PM but wait till 7 PM and just do it offer it up, right? Um, you could skip coffee. You could abstain from sugary stuff. You could eat intentionally.

¶253This is a good one cuz uh a lot of people just like for various health conditions, they just do need full calories for the day, right? Um, so what you could do though is you could eat intentionally bland meals. So don't put any salt, don't add any seasoning, don't add any sauce. So, something to consider. You can get all your calories.

¶254>> If you if you're going to have pasta for dinner, don't add the sauce. >> It's going to be kind of kind of gross, right? But that's the point. Like, it's edible. You can just eat pasta, right?

¶255Um, and it's not going to taste amazing. It's going to taste really bland and you're not going to like enjoy it. But that's the point, right? Like, and you're going to get all your calories that way. Um, it's just, you know, you're just depriving yourself of that taste and you can offer the gustatory pleasure and you can offer that up to God.

¶256Um, >> uh, you can abstain from certain kinds of food. You could only drink water. So like no sweet or savory alcoholic beverages. Okay, so that's like food or drink. There's also comfort stuff, right?

¶257So you could just like flog yourself with nettles. >> Yeah, nettle it. Nettle it up. Nettle it up. >> I'm mostly kidding on that one.

¶258Um you could I mean but like more seriously, you know, you could take a take a cold shower. You could wear something that's a bit uncomfortable. You could use less heat or AC. You could like unironically put like a tiny pebble in your shoe for a day. Um you could pray while walking barefoot on something that's uncomfortable.

¶259Not painful. Like, no, sorry. I should say not like permanently damaging. Okay. So, like don't walk on glass or like you certainly don't do that.

¶260Like, that's not what I'm saying. But hey, like you might not enjoy walking on like uh like a sidewalk or sometimes like a a road cuz it might be a little bit uneven. And like I don't know, I I I don't enjoy doing that barefoot. Um it's not like permanently damaging or anything, but like that's another thing you could do. You could just walk on that while praying.

¶261Um uh or you know, you could wear more clothes. You could refrain from wearing more clothes or a blanket when you're cold. You could sleep on something less comfortable than your bed. You could take the stairs at work or school instead of the elevator. You know, you could complete a tour that you just like.

¶262Um I don't know if you want to add stuff, but I mean I just think of the Wisconsin winters, right? Um so for me, there's just endless opportunity to to to offer it up with that. Um and I hate and like you know, you got to think about where you're coming from and like if you don't hate if you don't at least dislike it, right? Then you might be missing the opportunity. I hate the cold.

¶263I hate being cold. I hate it, right? Like seriously, because I run cold, my hands run cold. I am miserable when I am cold. So for me, anything cold related is just the sort of thing that I absolutely do not want to do.

¶264Um, but some other people might be opposite. I know people that love the like they love ice baths and stuff like that. So for them, like if you really love doing something, you're kind of missing the point, right? >> Yeah. >> It has to be something that is in some sense like a frustration of what your desire actually is, right?

¶265Exactly. because you need to discipline the flesh, right? Subject the flesh to the spirit so that the spirit is apt to rule the flesh. Um, >> and it sounds I'll give you example like this sounds a little bit silly, but again, it's always everyone's person relative, but my wife loves loves loves cream in her coffee and just like does not like coffee, no cream. But, you know, for like 3 months, she just gave up the cream in the coffee just for a little thing for me, right?

¶266Just just for a little thing for me. And like I don't know, I just found that so so beautiful. Right. Right. Cuz I know because I know how much she loves that, right?

¶267I'm like as as like as silly as it sounds, like I know that was not a small thing for her to give. Like that is like the her like >> mourning like reprieve from the constant like you know just stress that falls on her every day from having a very annoying husband and six children and all that sort of thing. Like her cream of coffee is like her one solace and she just gave that and she just gave that up for me. Right. >> Yeah.

¶268>> Yeah. And I feel like a lot of us, this is at least true of myself, we just have like little things, and I'm not saying this is true of your wife, but like we just have little things that we are just a bit too attached to, you know, like where we do just get a little bit too upset >> if I'm if I'm not that thing gets frustrated. Yeah. 100%. Exactly.

¶269Like if if >> you know if I have to eat like 1 hour later like or if I have to you know those sorts of things can be like deeply frustrated and that's just like a sign like hey this is a place that you can work on. So start to just like actively frustrate it and you'll just find yourself uh I suspect if you if you do this for a while you'll just find yourself less attached to those to those goods and you'll be able to give them up more and you won't be as angry when they get frustrated >> and like I mean ultimately it's a recipe for peace cuz you know there ultimately is just peace in having the spirit rule the flesh and just like resting in God, you know. >> So um that's comfort related. There's also technology and entertainment related. So you can give up social media for a day.

¶270You can have no phone until 3 p.m. You could limit entertainment and YouTube except for philosophy of the people in Madison Reason. Um, you know, you could give up you could give up certain time like you could like get up earlier to pray. You could give up some sleep to pray longer in the evening. You could give up some leisure time for spiritual reading.

¶271You could spend time visiting someone who's lonely. Um, you could give up money or possessions. So give out give out extra money to charity. Um, you could resist upgrading stuff that you don't need. >> There are other mortifications involving speech and your interior life.

¶272So um you could intentionally refrain from complaining, interrupting, criticizing, gossiping, sarcasm, self-promotion. You could like intentionally give up the last word as a mortification, right? Um very think about that one. Everyone watching this this channel, right? Especially given the nature of a lot of what we do, >> you know, apologetics, like almost everybody wants to have that last word.

¶273>> Yeah. >> Just sit on that one for a while, everyone. Right. Yeah. >> Yeah.

¶274And I mean, I've I've seen that this is something that I've been too attached to because, you know, with my conversion, like basically billions of people have responded to me and it's just like, sorry y'all. Um, I'm just going to let you I'm going to let you have the dialectical win and I'm just going to take the dialectical loss and I'm just not going to not going to be able to respond and I'm just going to, you know, I'm going to take that L basically, you know, and I can I can offer that up and I should offer it up more. Um, so yeah. Um, okay. Onwards to uh interior mortification.

¶275So, yeah, you could just like humbly and patiently accept being overlooked for something. >> Or you can resist curiosity about something that's none of your business. Or you can surrender the desire to be praised. Or you could patiently bear embarrassment or disappointment or inconvenience. Or another person's annoying habits.

¶276This is like this is St. Terz's little way basically, you know, like she just had to deal with a lot of other sisters in her convent or whatever. um nuns I think they're probably called and they just had lots of annoying habits. It's very evident and they were difficult to deal with. Um and she would just nevertheless go out of her way to do nice things for those people and she would just try not to focus on them.

¶277She would offer up the you know the inconvenience of it. Um so I don't know these interior mortifications and mortifications of involving speech are really good I think. Yes. Um especially for people who suffer from pride. >> Um >> now again be prudent consider your state in life.

¶278Don't take any of this too far. Don't do anything permanently damaging. God wants your heart. He doesn't want your blood, right? >> Um and another final thing, fast and mortify in secret.

¶279There's like a real temptation to pride with fasting and mortification, right? So, you need to be careful. Um >> don't worry about a fasting t-shirt, right? >> Right. No, and this is what Jesus says.

¶280He's like, you know, like anoint your heads on your fasting and like put on good clothes and whatnot and just like don't don't let other people >> um know that you're fasting >> because you know the father's in secret will will reward. Um okay, so that's the second pillar of the spiritual life is fasting. We've gone through prayer and fasting. I don't know if you have anything to add. >> No, I mean um yeah, it's just like just a little bit of background.

¶281I mean, I was interested in fasting before I converted just from um a physical health perspective and and stuff like that. And um and that's that's all that's all good and that's all fine and interesting and it is it is cool to see those those points of convergence. Um but it took on an entirely new meaning for me once I became Catholic, right? And like I just didn't really even care about uh maybe I maybe I cared a little bit about the the kind of physical side of it, but the spiritual dimension is is infinitely richer. So, right on.

¶282Oh, yeah. Two other things. So, one thing is, you know, I've just been listing all of that. Obviously, don't don't do like all of those in a day or something. Like, pick one thing.

¶283Pick one or two things, right? Um, and as I said, like when am I to do this? Well, here's a good start. As I said, every Friday is a penitential day, right? So, just pick one of those things and and look, a lot of your, you know, fast you create a fasted state when you're sleeping.

¶284I mean, hopefully, right? Um, >> and then like so just even just like again, you don't have to do like a full 24-hour fast. Even if you're just like pushing breakfast back a little bit. Yeah. It's a really good way to start.

¶285It doesn't it doesn't have to be this this this mega weekl long fast. Just hey, push breakfast back a bit. Maybe reduce the size of what you have for lunch two days per week, one day per week. Um yeah, it can be very very doable. Right.

¶286Mhm. Right. Exactly. Um and I guess another thing that I wanted to say was just uh uh No, wait. Did I already cover everything?

¶287>> You've covered a lot. I know that. No. Right. Um, yeah.

¶288So, ju just like consider adding these things. Oh, no. Yeah. The other thing that I want to mention is like you can turn any hardship or discomfort into a spiritual sacrifice by, you know, intentionally uniting it with Christ's passion, right? So, you also sometimes you don't even have to go out of your way to do these sorts of things.

¶289There are just in daily life frustrations and difficulties. You know, you stub your toe or you know, like someone is annoying or like yeah, you're just you're just impatient at something. you you can just turn those into opportunities to mortify and basically offer stuff up to God, you know, um and you could just sanctify those ordinary moments. So, that's another thing that I want to mention is like you sometimes >> you don't even have to go out of your way to do something. You could just take stuff that comes your way naturally and then offer it to God through spiritual sacrifices.

¶290And that's something that's good for Catholics to get into the habit of and that we often forget, which is like anytime you experience pain, anytime you experience discomfort, anytime you experience frustration, that's an opportunity to offer it up. So always just like have in your mind like I can offer this up to Christ and united to his passion for some sort of spiritually solitary end. Um so that's the other thing that I want to mention. >> Yeah. And just like things you wouldn't even like think of.

¶291So, you know, I do uh I do a lot of like music music stuff, too. And I always pray before performances, stuff like that that things won't go wrong. But sometimes things do go wrong and in really frustrating ways. And I always do try to like, all right, offer it up, right? Whatever it is, right?

¶292And just just any situation. I mean, sto toast dust stubbing is always great, right? Because that's I have like this long gangly toes, so I'm always hitting corners of things like that. So, that's a constant opportunity for me, right? Okay.

¶293So, we've gone through prayer and fasting. Onwards we march to almsgiving. So, this is the third pillar of the spiritual life. And to convey the importance of this to you guys, I want to read some stuff cuz this stuff might convict you. And I hope it does.

¶294>> Sound familiar. Yeah. Mhm. Okay. Thomas Aquinus in the Suma.

¶295I think this is uh the secund. I think this is I think it's like question 66 or article 66 or something. Um he says whatever a man has in super abundance is owed of natural right to the poor for their sustenance. So Ambrose says the bread that you withhold belongs to the hungry. The clothing you shut away to the naked and the money you bury in the earth is the redemption and freedom of the penniless.

¶296St. and Ambrose in in the year 38 395 continues, "You are not giving to the poor man anything that is yours, but are rather restoring something that is his." And in similar fashion, the 2 Vatican council says, "Men are obliged to come to the relief of the poor and to do so not merely out of their superfluous goods. If a person is in extreme necessity, he has the right to take from the riches of others what he himself needs. Since there are so many people in this world afflicted with hunger, this sacred council urges all both individuals and governments to remember the saying of the fathers, "Feed the man dying of hunger. For if you have not fed him, you have killed him." Okay.

¶297So, um the stuff that we kind of hoard belongs to other people and you are stealing from them. You are stealing from the poor if you don't give it away. That's what you're doing cuz they own it. This is the um universal destination of goods, part of Catholic social teaching. Um, but let's ratchet things up a little bit because things can get ratcheted up.

¶298John, John Chrysm says, "It is impossible, though we performed 10,000 other good deeds to enter the portals of the kingdom without almsgiving. >> It's impossible to be saved without almsgiving." According to John Chrysum, Thomas Aquinas says, "Some are punished eternally for omitting to give alms." Okay. And then our Lord clearly teaches that almsgiving is necessary for salvation. In Matthew 25, you know, he says, "When the son of man comes in his glory, sorry, this is what the sacred author writes in Matthew 25. Um, when the son of man comes in all his glory and all the angels with him, he will sit on his glorious throne.

¶299All the nations will be gathered before him and he will separate the people one from the other. As a shepherd separates sheep from the goats, he will put the sheep on his right and the goats on his left. Then the king will say to those on his right, "Come, you who are blessed by my father, take your inheritance, the kingdom prepared you since the creation of the world. For I was hungry and you gave me something to eat. I was thirsty and you gave me something to drink.

¶300I was a stranger and you invited me in. I needed clothes and you closed me. I was sick and you looked after me. I was in prison and you came to visit me. Then the righteous will answer him, Lord, when do we see you hungry and feed you or thirsty or give you something to drink?

¶301Like when did we see you a stranger and invite you in or needing clothes and clothe you? When do we see you sick or in prison and go to visit you? And the king will reply, truly I tell you, whatever you did for one of these least brothers of mine, you did for me. And then he will say to those on his left, "Depart from me, you who are cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels. For I was hungry and you gave me nothing to eat.

¶302I was thirsty and you gave me nothing to drink. I was a stranger and you did not invite me in. I needed clothes and you did not clothe me. I was sick and in prison and you did not look after me." They will also answer, "Lord, when did we see you hungry or thirsty or a stranger and needing clothes or sick or in prison and did not help you?" and he will reply, "Truly I tell you, whatever you did not do for one of the least of these, you did not do for me. Then they will go away to eternal punishment, but the righteous to eternal life." So this is pretty important.

¶303This almsgiving thing, right? Like notice these people, these goats, they're not described as murderers, as adulterers, as fornicators. That's not what they're described as. >> They're described as the people who didn't give arms, who didn't perform the corporal works of mercy. Right?

¶304That's how serious this is. This is a salvation issue. >> Yes. >> Okay. So, I I want you I want to convey to people the dire importance of almsgiving.

¶305Um and this is also, you know, you pointed out earlier like how um like kind of secular health kind of coincides with Catholic injunctions to fasting. This is another place where kind of like secular ethics kind of converges with Christian ethics. I think like I think some of the best arguments in secular ethics uh lead us to the conclusion that we are morally obliged to like donate or at least give away a pretty significant portion of our income at least according to our state in life. You know like you got to be credential but um you know like consider the shallow pond case. You've probably heard of this maybe your listeners haven't but you know you're walking by at a shallow pond.

¶306You've got these really expensive shoes that you just bought and that would be ruined by waiting into the shallow pond. Um but there's a child drowning in the shallow pond. So, are you going to just like let the child drown or are you going to walk in and ruin your new shoes to save them? Well, of course you're going to walk in and and save them, right? Like, it would be so cruel to just continue walking on because you just got these like thousand shoes.

¶307Um, but what that indicates is that um, you know, arguably we are required to help people in significant need, even at pretty significant cost to ourselves, even if it costs like thousands of dollars for us to do that. Um, because, you know, we're not giving up anything that's of comparable significance. Um, so yeah, I mean I just think there's a kind of convergence here between Christian ethics and uh secular ethics on this point. >> So, okay, what does almsgiving look like? I've talked about its importance.

¶308Um, well, firstly, you can give away time, right? So, you could volunteer work, you could do service, you could help others. Um, but secondly, and I I recommend this, you could give away money and resources. So, >> what I'm about to say, don't freak out because like it depends on your state in life, right? So, this crucially depends on your state in life.

¶309You just got to use your your your credential judgment and your conscience guided by Catholic principles. Okay. >> Um this depends on your state life. But like my own personal recommendation as just a personal recommendation is giving away at least 10% of your yearly income uh including to highly effective charities like the Against Malaria Foundation because those are ones that are like super effective in saving lives. Um so I mean that's different if you're just like barely scraping by and you can hardly even put bread on the table for your family.

¶310I'm not saying that they should go go and give away 10% of their income because, you know, you're obliged first and foremost to take care of, you know, like your family, the people that you brought into existence. >> Um, so yeah, I'm not saying if you're barely scraping by or if you're in like dire financial straits or that sort of thing. Um, but I think at least like a lot of people who are the sort of people who might be listening to this, >> yes, >> are the sort of people who do have a lot of excess income and the sort of people who like do live very comfortably and that sort of thing. Um, and I would just recommend considering giving more than you're giving. Um, and consider giving especially to effective charities like the one that I just mentioned, the Against Malaria Foundation, cuz they are actually like re I I'm hesitant because I'm scrupulous.

¶311I'm hesitant to like oblige people to things. But what I just will say is like listen on the one hand you could give away some money to like a local charity that you know you um there's like maybe a particular prominent place in your heart for um where but where it's like you know it's like getting train it's like takes let's say it takes $27,000 to like train to train you know one uh dog who's like uh serves as like the sight for the blind right and so like you could you could improve the life of someone who is blind by, you know, contributing to, let's say, 27 a $27,000 fund to train a single dog. You could do that. But on the other hand, like some of the best scientific estimates for like saving lives with the Against Malaria Foundation such that like your donations make a difference between someone being dead or alive, it's something around like $4,000, right? So like on the one hand, we have like saving a life for $4,000 and on the other hand, we have like improving someone's life for like $27,000.

¶312like I don't know there's a clear disparity here in effectiveness and I would at least encourage you to consider giving to the uh more effective charity in that case. >> Um I'm not saying there's no role for charities that have a special place in your heart. That's not what I'm saying. But I I just think we should be attuned to effectiveness when we're giving. >> Um >> okay.

¶313So um Catholics are also obliged by the way to support the church according to their financial situation and resources. So, um I don't think the church has a particular precept for like any numbers or anything like that, but you know, I think we're just obliged to support the church. So, keep that in mind. Um and yeah, just more generally cultivate a spirit of detachment from worldly goods. Like you can't serve God and money.

¶314Um and consider living in ways that are simpler than your means allow so that you can give away some of your wealth. Um and I mean I again I'm not trying to pontificate. I need to work on this stuff. Um, so you know, if you think I'm pointing pointing fingers when I say all this sort of stuff, like I've got three three fingers pointing back at me, right? Um, so that's what I have to say about armsgiving.

¶315I don't know if you want to add stuff, man. I mean, it's just it's always it's always so convicting, isn't it? Um, >> and this is I mean, this is sort of the nature of it, right? It's like if like if you're not being challenged by what the church demands I don't know what are the options there Joe like you're you're already in the botific vision or or what right >> I mean it's hard like it is demanding the spiritual life is demanding >> but >> we trust that God will give us what we need >> to get it to get it done right >> exactly >> and that's and it is that trust and that hope that is the the virtues. I mean, because we've been kind of like dance around this.

¶316I mean, you know, the idea of of trying to avoid two extremes, right, with um either the extreme of despair in certain situations or the the other extreme of presumption. What do you have with your salvation? Well, you have hope. You have this trust in God's um grace and God's love and and God's word. That's the right disposition to have.

¶317Um now, I lost my train of thought of where I was going with that. Um I don't know. This stuff is demanding. I mean, that's ultimately what you're saying, >> but yeah, it's it's demanding. Um, now it doesn't mean that ought implies can.

¶318I think for Catholics, that's false. But it does mean that ought implies can with help. And God is he's going to help us, right? And you can trust that he's going to help you with this, right? And you just need to make sure that you're cooperating with his grace and that you're willing what God wills.

¶319And he will affect that that transformation. and you will sometimes painfully and gradually um but you can have that trust. That's the point. That's the point I wanted to make and that's it. Yep.

¶320>> Yeah. >> Yeah. I don't know just like read the Gospel of Matthew or something, you know, like it's it's very convicting like you know like I think this is in Matthew where um the person comes up to Jesus and is like what else do I have to do to inherit the kingdom and Christ is like sell all your goods and follow me and he he goes away sad you know. So like are we the ones who are going away sad? Um, or are we the ones who are just like very liberal and generous with our our wealth and whatnot so that we can be followers of Christ?

¶321And I don't know, like the more you you're going to lose it all anyways. Just remember that, >> right? I mean, yeah. Remember your death. I mean, this is why I and a lot of >> I don't know like Dominicans and Jesuits, we carry around like >> this little momento my guy cuz it's like it's a constant.

¶322And I've got this up here. this this um this not it's not an icon. It's just like a a painting and it's like a a skull and it says um what you are I once was. What I am you will surely become. >> Yeah.

¶323Yeah. >> So like you are dust and unto dust you shall return. And like this stuff this stuff is just like this temporary nonsense, right? Like this like this doesn't matter. Um like you're going to be dust in the ground someday.

¶324Like you're going to die. We're all going to die. And all you're going to have at that point is like the charity that you had in your life, the character of your soul, right? >> Yeah. That's all you're going to have.

¶325Like, and you're going to stand before Christ, and he's going to demand an accounting of your life, right? >> Mhm. >> So, just like constantly remember your death. Like, we're all going to die. You're going to die, dear listener.

¶326I'm going to die. And like, you need to prepare. You need to prepare for death. Um, and like I don't know. This is one way to prepare for death.

¶327And like, yeah, I don't know. But the more you read Christ in the Gospels, the more sense of like radical kind of giving you get and the more like urgent it seems and the more you read like these church documents and like what our saints are saying, you know, like you're stealing from the poor and like >> you're restoring what's what's theirs and like you know the the Vatican second Vat like Vatican 2 is saying like you need you need to give not merely out of your superfluous goods and yeah like Aquinus is saying some people are punished eternally some people are damn Jesus himself is saying like these people who don't give they're damned. So like I don't know. Um this stuff matters people and I care about your souls and I care about my soul. You know I'm trying to convict myself as well.

¶328Um so yeah I don't know. The Christian life is radical and like it should look radical and if it doesn't look radical then maybe something is wrong. Um so yeah um and yeah it's tough. It's hard, but you know, through God's grace, we can we can at least approximate the perfection that he calls us to. So, yeah, that's almsgiving.

¶329I just I wanted to be very clear with that and make it kind of convicting for the audience. Um, on to like one of the final things that I wanted to talk about. Um, there just a few more things. One of them is just like the seven deadly sins. And this was like super helpful from um Brandt Petri's book for me at least.

¶330Mhm. >> Um so like just like going through what they are and then like what are the correlative virtues and then how do you build the correlative virtues? >> Yeah. >> Um >> so like firstly of course keep in mind prayer like ultimately you're going to build these virtues through prayer. So like ask God to give you the virtues and to stamp out the deadly sins or the vices, right?

¶331But let's just like go through these the seven deadly sins together with the correlative virtues and how to like cultivate them. But maybe maybe uh Pat you'll have some stuff to add. Um so the first deadly sin first and foremost is pride right um which is something like a disordered self-love or an irrational desire for selfexaltation. >> Mhm. >> And the correlative virtue as we all know is humility which is roughly speaking like truthfully recognizing your complete dependence on God acknowledging your limitations and your sins without denying the gifts that God has given you.

¶332Right? So you need to be like you need to have an accurate appraisal of um you know the gifts and your sins and whatnot. >> Um and then finally refusing to seek your own >> excellence in a disordered way, right? >> Um it's all about like a right ordering of your appraisal of yourself um compared to others and compared to God first and foremost, >> right? >> Um >> so yeah, how to cultivate humility and stamp out pride?

¶333Well, I'd be curious to hear some things that you might contribute, Pat, but here are some things that I think might help. Firstly, look up what's called the litany of humility and pray it. It's going to be there. We got it right in our kitchen. >> It's going to be convicting.

¶334Like, you're going to read it. You're like, "Oh my gosh. Oh no." >> There's also like a timistic litany of humility, which is really good. That's in um >> Hold on. >> I'm sure you can find it online, but it's in this book, The Fruit of Her Womb, um by Father Bonafice Hicks.

¶335Um yeah. Uh but let's see. Yeah. I mean, I don't know that that that that line of visibility is kind of rough cuz you're reading it, you're like, "Oh, man." >> It's so convicting, but it's so >> I don't put it up in your kitchen over the sink so when you're washing dishes, you can you can have that there. Um that's that's what we do, right?

¶336Cuz that's a humble act, right? Taking on those I mean, here's here's the thing, like this is something I had to learn. I mean, I was so prideful. Even my last, you know, previous confession, the priest again is like, "Pat, this is all pride. Here's what you got to go do." Right?

¶337So, I really struggle with it. Um, and I was the kind of I was the kind of guy who for so long just thought like >> so much was beneath me, right? Like washing dishes is like this is a poor use of my time. I should be doing great things, right? Um, so for me, you know, the corrective to that is like nothing is beneath me.

¶338Nothing. Right? I I'm going to wash the dishes, right? And I'm going to recite the litany of humility, right? you know, um, and make sure that that it's there, right?

¶339Like that these things that I thought I was too good for and too important for, you know, over years like, and just like forcing myself to see that no, I am not above these things or because really what you're saying is you're above other people, right? It's fine if other people do these things, but because you're more important than other people, that's why it's beneath you. And you can see like that is that is so deeply perverse, >> so deeply perverted. So it's not even just like thinking about other people really like what I was saying about certain things being beneath me, it was a direct comparison and over inflation of myself to other people, right? Um so that is that is that just one one of many ways that I immensely struggled with it.

¶340And then just forcing yourself uh to do those things that you might have previously thought were not a good use of your time or or were beneath you itself can be uh extremely extremely humbling. You use the phrase earlier Joe I think is also very important. taking the L, right? Um, allowing yourself to be humiliated in certain circumstances, really painful, but can be so spiritually therapeutic as well, whatever that is. You know, typically it's going to be things that you think you really are good at and that you really care about, right?

¶341I don't care if I take an L in basketball. Nobody does. Nobody expects me to have a W in that, right? >> Yeah. But always having to get the last word in some sort of debate or some apologetic or philosophy thing uh or three or four other things in my life that are really important hurts to take the L there.

¶342But that's that's where it needs that's where it needs to happen, >> right? >> Mhm. >> Yeah. This is where um Brent Petri is really good because he he urges his readers a lot of this is taken the seven deadly sins stuff of my notes. A lot of it is taken from him.

¶343Um he urges readers to try to identify their primary fault out of all the seven deadly sins because at least a lot of us will have like a primary fault among them. Like maybe some of us are like just sloth is our primary fault or we'll get we'll go through the other ones momentarily but um but yeah I mean my primary fault is pride. Um, and yeah, no, and it's it's it's been very salient uh over the past, you know, couple of weeks cuz, you know, like there are just all these people like responding to me and I've and you know, like my uh reputation is being damaged in various ways and I've just it has psychologically affected me in ways that it wouldn't if I weren't if I weren't super prideful, right? So, I've just I've noticed that I am way too attached to my reputation and just like agilation and people, you know, praising me and whatnot, like way too attached to that. And God has um, you know, been been using this process to as a kind of purgative, you know, he's purging me of I mean, I'm not I'm certainly not rid of it yet, >> right?

¶344>> But he's he's using the pain and suffering that I've experienced to Yeah. Yeah. To humble the proud and to cast the mighty from their thrones. Um me foremost among which, right? Um so yeah, just like I'll say some other things that help cultivate pride, but also just like rec the first step is recognition, right?

¶345You got to recognize you got a problem before you solve it. Um and so yeah, that that's that's my foremost and I think that's I mean that's the case for a lot of academics certainly. Um yeah, but um but yeah, so other things I mean the lint of humility is super convicting. You you're reading through it, it's like oh my gosh, I I share like none of these desires. Like some of them like that others be exalted above me.

¶346Right. Yes. Right. >> It's like whoa. Like this is this is super base.

¶347But like also it's like a man I don't I don't share any of these desires. >> Checking none of these boxes. Right. >> You're like I am such a failure. >> Um okay.

¶348The litany of humility is good. Um yeah like readily admit mistakes. Resist comparison. Mortifications aimed at pride are going to be helpful here for like you know curbing pride. So you know biting your tongue letting others get the last word letting others mock or deride you um taking the L as you said um meditation right this this is going to help.

¶349So um I in particular mysteries of the rosary that are helpful for this are going to be yeah um the visitation with Mary's magnificat right um extremely helpful for for pride but also the crowning with thorns right um this is the god of the universe and they are just like mocking him spitting on him and like placing this like crown of thorns on his head when he really is the king and he's like sustaining them in being and he's like even willing anticcedently their salvation as they're doing this um and and yet that's how they treat and you know I would have done the I would have done the same given all my past mortal sins like I would have done the same if I were back then um and you know with Christ they were like mocking him spitting on him and he just took it. >> Mhm. >> And this is the God of the universe just taking it and like you know they put this robe upon him and they give him this reed and they're like striking him as well and he's just humbly submitting to all of it at the whole time. I mean what rad I mean it's just like the most radical humility you could possibly imagine. I mean, just think about like how truly dignified and honorable and glorious God is.

¶350>> Mhm. >> Infinitely so. And it's just like the most perverted way that they're treating him and he's just submitting to it humbly. I mean, the more you think about it, just the more insane it gets and you see how drastically far you fall from that. Um, so yeah, meditate on the crowning of thorns, meditate on Mary's Magnificat, and just like other things to meditate upon.

¶351So, don't get into like self-disc you need to love yourself, right? So, you know, be careful about that. But just some things. Firstly, uh all of our accomplishments are utterly insignificant compared to the glory of the least of the saints in heaven. Keep that in mind.

¶352Secondly, uh I've been so you know, use I for you guys when you're thinking about this meditating on this. I've been confidently wrong and boastful in very cringe ways in the past and even in the present. Um, I, you know, like holy religious sisters, you know, who basically spend all day praying are just like far more pleasing to God than I'll probably ever be, right? U, no matter my worldly accomplishments, like no matter what I publish, no matter where you what videos I make, um, these holy religious are going to be far more pleasing in God's eyes than like I'll ever amount to. So, it's like a taking a bit of humble pie there.

¶353um like yeah praying the rosary as I said earlier and this is like some of these things are things that Ethan has has helped me with um to reflect on but yeah praying the rosary is the most important and profitable work that I will do all day today even if I like publish something in like a Google venue just like so far less important uh and far less profitable and meritorious than praying a single decade of the rosary um >> and like just viewing yourself as a mere steward of your gifts like you didn't earn them >> uh they can easily be taken away from you in a jify, right? Like, you know, we're merely we're mere stewards of our gifts. >> They're not ours. Their source is God. Their end is God.

¶354>> Um, so just keeping that in mind and meditating on that. Um, and also meditating on the fact that like more a more holy person would have achieved so much more with the same gifts that we were given. Also can also just help mortify your um >> your pride. >> Um, and that like probably to a large extent we've wasted our potential, you know. Um, >> so yeah, those are some things that can help mortify pride.

¶355Um, maybe I'll go through the other ones a little bit more quickly. Um, but yeah, so, uh, envy is the next deadly sin. Um, which is just like an irrational sadness over someone else's good fortune and a covetous desire to possess what rightly belongs to them. >> And, um, Petri identifies the kind of correlative virtue of this as mercy, which he defines as compassion towards others as misfortune. And so here, like the best things to do are going to be the corporal works of mercy to try to combat the envy.

¶356So like feed the hungry, clothe the naked, give drink to the thirsty, shelter the homeless. Um and also the spiritual works of mercy, right? So instructing the ignorant, counseling the doubtful, admonishing sinners, bearing wrongs patiently, forgiving offenses willingly. >> Um comforting the afflicted. Uh the next deadly sin is anger.

¶357So this is like, okay, listen, we're not talking about like the bare emotion of anger. That's not sinful. Um we're talking about irrationally or disorderly angry reactions, you know, to perceived offenses. It's all about like moderation and whether or not it's proportional to the offenses and whether or not there's like sufficient reason for it. So like the irrational or disorderly anger here seeks vengeance.

¶358It overreacts. It punishes excessively. Um and yeah, that's a deadly sin. Um to kind of counteract this, you need to cultivate meekness, which is basically like gentleness or refusing to be overcome by anger because you you trust in God. Um and yeah, so how do you cultivate meekness?

¶359Well, you forgive liberally. You empathize instead of, you know, giving the finger to the guy who cut you off. Think about, okay, dude, maybe he's going through a divorce right now and is extremely stressed, right? >> And this is just a manifestation of his stress. Uh, like that may very well be the case.

¶360Who are you to judge? Right? So, pray for them at that moment in instead of flipping them off, pray for them. Just say, "Lord God, please bless this person and just pray Hail Mary for them." >> Um, you know, uh, aspirations here can also really help with um with, you know, people who struggle with anger. um just like continually throughout the day.

¶361Pray regularly, give those aspirations like Lord Jesus Christ, I entrust myself to you. You know that sort of thing. >> Um next deadly sin is greed. So this is an irrational or moderate desire to acquire wealth or possessions and the correlative virtue is generosity. So being liberal and giving away wealth and possessions.

¶362So here the best >> the best antidote to greed is almsgiving. Um and also abstaining from created goods like technology. Um next deadly sin is lust. So this is disordered desire for sexual pleasure. Um the correlative virtue as we all know is chastity which is rightly ordering your sexual appetite.

¶363Um so how do you cultivate chastity? Well you avoid near occasions of sexual sin. So get app blockers you know like make it very hard like get brick. It's basically like impossible to bypass for the most part. I mean you get like five emergency bypasses but um it's like you literally have to physically get up and like walk to your like fridge for example and like put your phone on it.

¶364That gives you a lot of time to deliberate before doing something bad. Right. >> Right. Yeah. That's good.

¶365uh or you know like literally if you start feeling the temptation to just like go outside and jump in the snow like I kid you not that I mean that's going to be better than stamping out charity in your soul and incurring eternal damnation if you die without uh the sacrament of reconciliation or perfect contrition. So um so yeah just like avoid near occasions of sexual sin and relationships like immediately that you're in which are occasions of sexual sin. Um >> keep custody of the eyes. So, you know, like don't let your eyes wander to places that they shouldn't wander. Just like, you know, custody of the eyes and ask God to give you the grace of custody of the eyes.

¶366Custody of the mind, right? So, don't let your mind wander in places. And if you see it involuntarily wandering as you're like passively watching, gently redirect its course. >> Yes. >> Um, >> good.

¶367>> Also, another huge thing that people point out as like a way to combat against lust is fasting, right? So, fasting and and uh mortifications um specifically directed Yeah. just like subjecting the flesh to the spirit. Um, so >> like really like fasting from food I think can be helpful with this. >> Um, a lot of people say like manual labor is also going to be good cuz you just get out a lot of energy.

¶368Um, and just build self-control and selfmastery. And then I don't know, I've also heard lots of people say and I think it's really cool and I just want to repeat it because I think it's cool. It's like dude >> uh for people who struggle with like masturbation or pornography like pick up the Daily Rosary. Like if you continue with the Daily Ros like either the porn's going to stop or the rosary is going to stop. Like one of the two is going to give way.

¶369They're not going to be mutual. So just pray the daily rosary and it's not they're not eventually they're not going to coexist. Um >> so yeah, I'd recommend the rosary also for chastity. It's going to be a huge boost and the intercession of um St. Joseph.

¶370He's uh huge for chastity. >> Um >> okay, the next uh the sixth deadly sin is gluttony. So that's disordered or moderate desire for um the pleasure of food or drink. And of course the correlative virtue is temperance. So that's rightly ordering your appetite for food or drink.

¶371Fasting of course is going to be the way to combat against gluttony. But also just like um I had but I've been alerted to interesting ways you can um exhibit like venial sins um or commit venial sins of gluttony um by like eating too fast or like neglecting conversation when you're eating >> too picky about what you eat. Um yeah this guy >> no I mean eating too fast I you know I just I don't know I'm a bit of a voracious eater right? to like eating too fast. >> When I was first becoming Catholic, I'm like, "Oh, gluttony, you know, I'm I'm thin.

¶372I don't have to worry about that." But I was like the most gluttonous person in the world. I was so such a snob and so picky about what I ate, you know? I'm like, "Oh, it's like hugely ironic, right?" And like so totally devastating when I found out, oh, turns out the sinner is me, right? >> Yeah. >> Yeah.

¶373So, yeah. No, that's something that I think people miss is that gluttony is not just So, one way you can be gluttonous is Yeah. eating too much. >> Yeah. But there are lots of other ways.

¶374>> Lots more ways to be glad than just that. >> You could eat way too fast. >> You could neglect conversation when you're eating. Like, you know, I'm not saying like, you know, you don't always have to talk like, but you know, it's like that's a social event. You know, you should pay going to somebody's house and like turning your nose up at what they give you cuz for whatever reason doesn't meet your standards like Yeah.

¶375>> Yeah. Being too picky. Um I mean it's different like if you have like, you know, um moral qualms about, you know, the providence of something or, you know, whatever. >> Or you got like a legit food allergy or something like that's different, right? Yeah.

¶376>> Yeah. Um like I don't like parsley on my eggs. Get this away from me. >> Yeah. Um also dude other ones um seasoning food to excess, right?

¶377So basically just like just think like being just too focused on the gustatory pleasure and just like way like seizing them way too much. That's also venely sinful. My that's my understanding. Um and yeah uh just like pay attention to how much you eat, how fast you eat. Like you got to be temperant here.

¶378Um and I I don't know. I was I found it surprising that there are more ways to venally sin with respect to glass gloves. >> Imagine my surprise at that one, Joe. >> Yeah. Yeah.

¶379>> Right. But okay, here's one box I don't check for this. Oh, wait. >> Got that one, too. Right.

¶380Yeah. >> Yeah. Yeah. Um, so yeah, that I mean, yeah, the whole eating fast and uh, you know, neglecting conversation. I still need to work on that.

¶381Um, man, but anyway, um, sloth, that's the final deadly sin or or Aadia. Um, so this is basically just like a disordered inclination to apathy or laziness and fulfilling your duties. And then with Aadia specifically, it's like your spiritual or your religious duties. Um, and then the correlative virtue is like diligence or zeal. Zeal is like the spiritual dimension.

¶382So that's basically just like fulfilling your duties promptly and with care. So yeah, I mean how to combat against sloth? Well, you know, set a schedule in a routine. You know, habits make things easier. Um, break your duties up into small tasks that are super manageable, right?

¶383Uh, limit these easy escape routes. So maybe like you know just picking up your phone that's right next to you is going to be an easy escape route. >> So okay. So then when when you want to have a work session just like put your phone on top of the fridge and then go to another room or something or just like you know lock it somewhere or whatever. So like basically make those com comfortable escapes more difficult.

¶384>> Um >> okay so those are the seven deadly sins. Think about which one in the audience. Think about which one you struggle with most and start trying to cultivate the correlative virtue um through the various means that I mentioned. Um and yeah, all this has been super all this is like based on um Brandt Petri's introduction to the spiritual life. Yeah.

¶385>> Um >> I guess the final thing before I conclude is just like yeah another thing that should be an element of your spiritual life is spiritual reading and study. >> Yes. >> So um you know like we can't neglect the word of God, right? So like nourish yourself with the word of God like read the scriptures. Uh I really need to work on this but um it'd be good to read scriptures daily.

¶386I don't yet. I should but I don't. Um so yeah, that's something I would recommend. Now spiritual in terms of spiritual reading, you can read like contemporary stuff. So um some things that I think could be helpful.

¶387Well, firstly, if you want to learn how to pray the rosary, >> here are two really good things. The contemplative rosary u with St. John Paul II and St. Theresa and then how to pray a rosary. I think this is Ascension Presents.

¶388Yeah, sorry. Ascension Press. Um so these two things will help you pray a better rosary. Um in terms of other contemporary things, yeah, Brent Petri's introduction to the spiritual life that I just shared this um plan of life by Roger J. Landry.

¶389Um now most of the so a lot of these are my Sunday reading and most of these I have not read. So I I've read um Brandt Petri's book. I've read that >> I haven't read plan of life. I'll have to look at that one yet. >> I've been recommended this now.

¶390I don't know like for those who are like very um I don't know more advanced in the spiritual life, this might not be as useful. I don't know. I feel like this um it just talks a lot about uh building the spiritual life I think and it talks about the importance of well yeah all different sorts of things but I haven't actually read this a lot of the things that I'm about to recommend they're like on my >> you know to read list um but like I have high order the reason why I'm comfortable recommending them is because I have high order evidence that they're you know >> yeah right >> like legit. >> Um okay Navigating the Interior Life with Dan Burke. Um I've listened to some things that Dan Burke has produced on YouTube and they're they're like really good.

¶391Um, so that's another one you could consider. Um, obviously the Catechism of the Catholic Church, that's like really good for um, Right. I mean, even spiritual reading, like honestly, it's like a beautiful document. >> It was transformative for me when I was first looking at the at the faith. Yeah.

¶392Mhm. >> Yeah. And for study as well. So spiritual reading and study that. And then I guess another one that that I recommend is this handbook of prayers student edition.

¶393There's like a teacher edition, which is a little bit more daunting, but the student edition is really good. And dude, it's like it's like a really good it's basically just like I don't know. It's got everything in here. like I I'm sorry, but like it's just so good. I kind of want to just give it give it a plug.

¶394So, the first kind of section is how to be a better Catholic. And it just talks about okay, here's how to like here are what the days of penance are. Here are the different works of mercy. Here are what indulgences are, what indulgences are and how you can get them. Um here are what sacramentals are.

¶395Here are the different virtues. Um here's the difference between mortal and venial sin. Here are devotions that you can do during the week. Um here's how to build your spiritual game plan. Um okay.

¶396Then it gets you basic prayers. So then it goes through all the different like basic prayers that a lot of people know. Um then it gives it has a huge section on what mass is and preparation for mass. So various internal preparations, prayers before mass, guidelines for receiving communion, prayers after mass that you can pray. Um it's got um guidelines for Eucharistic adoration.

¶397So like you know it's got all the songs that people do in benediction and whatnot that you pray there. Um and it's got prayers to do during Eucharistic adoration. And it's got this huge amazing this is the best uh examination of conscience that I've come across. It's got this um guide for a good confession. So, it talks about the conditions that you need for a valid confession.

¶398It's got this big examination of conscience and it it includes ones that other some others miss that I think are important. So, it includes for instance, you know, like willfully entertaining um impure thoughts that we talked about earlier and that a lot of people actually miss that one. Um and well, at least some that I've seen miss that in their examination of conscience. Um it's got stuff to do after confession. It's got the whole guide to what happens during confession and it's got just all these different prayers.

¶399Devotions to the blessed trinity, devotions to the blessed mother, devotions to the Holy Spirit, devotions to Jesus Christ. Um, it's got how to pray the rosary. It's got different reflections in here. Sorry, I could go on, but I think this is a really good book. >> Yeah.

¶400Fantastic. Yeah. >> Handbook of prayers, student edition by James Socius. I don't know. Sius, S O C I A S.

¶401Um, okay. So, those are some contemporary things in terms of some classics. Now, you know, to my shame, I have not read these yet, but I really want to. Um, so, uh, let's see. Actually, I'll just I'll just show the ones I have.

¶402Okay. So, you know, one classic is The Imitation of Christ by Thomas A. Kempus. >> Yeah. A friend got that.

¶403A close friend who was a Catholic. He actually teaches at Villanova got that for me as a confirmation. Yeah. Yeah. >> Beautiful.

¶404Have you read it? >> Uh, no. Shamefully, not all of it, but not all of it. I just don't mean to shame you. Yeah, I just I was just asking.

¶405I haven't. It's It's I know where it is, though. Um Okay, good. >> Yep. Yep.

¶406Yep. Um the other one that I think um is probably maybe the first one of the classics that you should read, I haven't read this, is um an introduction to the devout life by St. Francis de Sales. Um it's it's kind of like I think Brandt Petri drew significant inspiration from this, but I think it >> I've been recommended this very strongly. Um okay, other ones that are very important, the spiritual exercises of St.

¶407Ignatius. Um >> so that's another huge one very influential in our tradition. um the latter of divine ascent um by St. John Clamakus. >> Uh this one I've been recommended and again I haven't I haven't read these yet but I really want to.

¶408And then finally the 12 steps of holiness and salvation by St. Alfonsus Lori. Um and then also like works by saints. So I got this one cuz I think it I Matt Frad recommended it for people who struggle with script philosophy. I haven't read it yet but again I want to.

¶409Um it's St. Terzio I believe in love. >> Um a personal treat based on the teaching of St. Terresa Lizio. So, I think it probably just has like a lot of her um I'm guessing it has a lot of her like reflections and whatnot in here, but um it's by Father Jean C whatever.

¶410I don't know. Um okay, so that's like some spiritual reading and study. And then I guess I do you have anything to add before I like conclude? >> I'm so other ones I mean look confessions was actually really impactful for me. >> Oh yeah, dude.

¶411Yeah. >> So I you know obviously want to put that one in. Um, this one I mean I don't know. I don't I mean I've read it so many times and I've I found it to be extremely profitable even though it isn't like like suffused with Catholic doctrine. Um is the consolation of philosophy.

¶412Um, and I know it's it's a bit unclear exactly like what Botheus's status was, but that would that that one actually had a big effect on me as I was becoming Catholic as well. And I think it is just a a profitable classic in general, right? I mean, like this is just would have been what like like everybody studied for centuries until suddenly they didn't anymore, right? Um >> Um Yeah. I mean, and then like just I mean, like, you know, I I gotta I gotta plug Thomas and like we you know, we we we spent a lot of time talking about like his arguments for God, but just go read his commentary on John and stuff like that.

¶413Um I know I know after we're we're done with this, I'll be like, "Oh, dang. I forgot this this this and the other thing." So, sorry for not being prepared, but there at least a few a few additional items there. Yeah. Mhm. Awesome.

¶414So, yeah. Okay. So that you know in conclusion and before we wrap up with some stuff I guess I'll just say like this may seem overwhelming but remember people it all boils down to two commandments right love God with all your heart mind and soul and love your neighbor that's that's fundamentally what's going on here right uh and just start building up slowly you know introduce one prayer at a time one practice at a time one fast or mortification at a time don't overwhelm yourself right maybe commit to a single decade a day for a month. A single decade of the rosary that is a day for a month and then maybe in the second month build up two decades a day. A decade takes like two or three minutes, right?

¶415Um and so and and also I'll just say like and like again um I mean this is such a good important point. There are are books that I I have spiritual books including the ones that are against me like like the imitation of Christ. It's been many years I still haven't read that one. Right. But hey, like all right, I'll tell you what.

¶416I'll make it say like when we're done here, I'm finally going to go pick it up and start on that one, right? >> Yeah. Yeah. And I do I mean absolutely like this is Yeah. Don't want to put the impression here like uh certainly I don't have this all >> figured out or locked down and as much a work in in progress as as anybody.

¶417Right. Yeah. >> Same. Yeah. I'm massively here.

¶418Yeah. No, I mean Sundays are days that I try to set aside for like spiritual reading and whatnot because >> Yeah. I mean, Sundays are days of rest for us. So, like we >> Yeah, we are morally required. I mean, this is one thing that I didn't mention.

¶419Catholics are morally required not to perform um any works on Sunday that meet the following conditions. They, you know, they hinder the worship due to God. They uh hinder the joy property of the Lord's day. And then there's one other thing, but you know, you can read that in the catechism or whatever. Uh so, like, yeah, we shouldn't be doing or yeah, appropriate relaxation of mind and body.

¶420Um that don't kind of hinder that. Um, so like Sunday should look noticeably different from all your other days basically. Um, it should be much more leisurely. It should be much more peaceful like that. You should be looking forward to that.

¶421You should not be setting aside Sundays >> for like all of your homework for example or like all of your work that you need to do. Um, >> so like your catchup day. Yeah. Absolutely right. >> No.

¶422Yeah. That's that's as I understand it that's sinful for Catholics. Um so uh yeah you should definitely be dedicating Sunday like as like a a leisurely day. Now what leisure looks like that's you know your state in life but um >> for me it'll look like not doing uh YouTube work and philosophy work uh but instead like spiritual reading. So you know it takes it'll then take me a long time to get through stuff because I like dedicate Sunday to this sort of reading.

¶423But um but yeah these are the sorts of things that I would like to read on Sundays going forward. Yeah. >> Um but uh but yeah, so I guess don't overwhelm yourself. Commit to like a single decade a day maybe and then build up if you want to do the rosary, which I highly recommend. You know, be gentle with yourself when you when you fall.

¶424Like you will fall. Like I'm sorry, but but again, always pick yourself back up and return to God with all your heart, right? Uh and and that's ultimately, you know, that's ultimately what's what's going to matter is that you you just returned to Christ. you kept on returning to him and you never you never permanently left him until death, right? Um so yeah, I mean that's like just to give a little overview of what we've gone through u for the audience, you know, we started with the absolute basics.

¶425Love God with all your heart, mind, and soul. Love your neighbor as yourself. And then we built on that. How do you keep that love? How do you not stamp out supernatural charity from your soul?

¶426Well, you remain in a state of grace. How do you do that? Well, you participate in the sacramental life of the church. You attend mass frequently. You go to adoration and whatnot.

¶427But also you don't commit mortal sins. We went through some of those mortal sins. But you don't just want to ma remain in a state of grace. You want to grow in grace. So that's where we got into the three pillars of the spiritual life.

¶428Prayer, fasting and almsgiving. We talked about different kinds of prayer, different modes of prayer. Lexio Deina, the rosary, various other things you can do there. Uh we went through um fasting and mortifications. We got a lot of principles for fasting.

¶429We talked about what people are what Catholics are obliged to do um at minimum, but then also how to go beyond that and incorporate that into daily life. And we talked about a bunch of different kinds of fast modifications that you can do involving, you know, money and interior modifications and modifications of speech and modifications involving food and water and technology and whatnot. Um, and then after that we went on to almsgiving and we talked about why this is a very significant matter and our Lord says that you know it's like a damnable sin to neglect these corporal works of mercy. So um yeah, we just talked about the importance of just being liberal and generous with your wealth uh and giving away um money and time as well. Um, so yeah, we talked about almsgiving and then we went on to the seven deadly sins, right?

¶430So we talked about how like these are the sins you should try to like the vices that you should try to stamp out of your life. We talked about the corive virtues and how to try to build them. >> Um, and then after that, let me just consult my thing. We talked about some spiritual reading and study. That's also an important plank of the spiritual life.

¶431>> Um, and then yeah, we uh we just concluded. So that that's all I got in terms of my presentation. And Joe, I am I am so glad that this was the first public conversation we've had. Obviously, we've been connected for a while behind the scenes and it's it's really been wonderful getting to know you and and become your friend and and and see everything going on in your life. It's just it's it's amazing.

¶432And um you know, just as like a a short little you know, personal uh thing maybe note to to end on uh before I I'll let everyone see the the Basset Hound here. Um, you know, obviously over a lot of the years, Joe, people were always asking, "Yeah, you got to respond to Joe on his, you know, 49,000 objections to the the faith or or or toism or whatever." And I always knew I wouldn't be able to do all like like you feel now, like it's just too much too much to respond to all the time. Yeah. I'll do what I can, but I know what I what I really can do is I can I can pray for him. I can pray for Joe.

¶433And I did pray for you. I prayed for you a lot as as I pray as I try to pray for for for everybody uh you know that that that comes across and it just goes to show that how important that is right like philosophy arguments cool interesting they serve some purpose kind of right but at the end of the day what's really going on mechanically is is not really that right right um right it's it's it's it's much it's much more spiritually significant. Um, so don't forget that. Uh, and um, I hope this I hope this episode gentle listeners, don't forget the importance of prayer is what I'm saying, right? So much more important than like trying to, you know, formalize your next argument or whatever.

¶434>> Yeah. Um, if I could just add to that, um, yeah, I mean, if if you're faced with the option of spending five minutes typing in the last response to the dude on Facebook or on Substack or on YouTube or Twitter on one hand, and on the other hand, praying a decade or two of the rosary for that person and their conversion, I am like basically certain that praying is going to be much more effective in bringing about their conversion. converion than trying to get them that last response. >> So like prayer is going to be much more important and significant and salutary and bring about conversions than uh you know being able to intellectually best them. Um cuz like listen like you know God's a smarter guy than you, right?

¶435So like God will God you know through the graces obtained from your prayers like God will basically put the right things in front of them such that if they cooperate in the right way you know they will um you know cooperate with God into salvation right they'll >> Mhm. >> So like God God will God will take care of it. Um so anyway I just wanted to end with that. >> No fantastic Joe um for first off I hope that this resource can serve as as as something ongoing for people. You covered so much ground.

¶436I'm so impressed. This is this is awesome. I'm really excited for people to see this. Uh, what else do you want to announce? I mean, remind people obviously remind people of your channel where they can connect with you.

¶437Anything else you're you're working on or Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I guess the the biggest thing is just Majesty of Reasons. You guys can subscribe to that. Um, and yeah, honestly, not much more than that.

¶438I mean, I I've got a Substack that, you know, I'll be more active when things settle down a little bit. Um, it's called the Veritata Splendor or the Splendor of Truth. That's with my friend Noah. um Noah McKay, we're both um PhD students here at Princeton. >> So um >> those are the two places that people can go.

¶439Um and if they want to read some of my papers, you know, some of the more recent ones, maybe not the ones that defend heresy, but um some of the more recent ones, they can go to my website, josephid.com. Um and yeah, they can check out my stuff there. Awesome. God bless you, Joe. By the way, everyone, here's the uh here's the bassad hound that's been just hanging out during this conversation.

¶440So I talk about a little bored. I'm like really hot sitting here with this kind of heavy dog on me right now. So, we're going to offer that up. And uh yeah, thanks for the awesome conversation, Joe. God bless everyone.

¶441Take care. Thank you.